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Author Topic: The SHOW Newport Impressions - adding to the stream of consciousness.  (Read 14662 times)

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DaveBSC

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Re: The SHOW Newport Impressions - adding to the stream of consciousness.
« Reply #30 on: June 02, 2013, 06:49:03 AM »

Kef LS50

I got very curious about these after looking at Stereophile's reviews. Seemed like the tweeter and woofer well very well integrated, good off-axis response, and smooth FR. Maybe it was bias, but I loved this setup. Remarkable bass for it's size. Indeed good off-axis response. Highs seemed very nice (did not perceive brightness or rolled off stuff there.) Loved the intelligibility... Something I absolutely hate about my Mirage Nanosats (Have to constantly press movie subtitles due to FR aberrations.)


How did you find the soundstage of the LS50? I've not been the biggest fan of KEF in the past, (XQ series in particular was disappointing despite the gorgeous looks) bit since they introduced their "tangerine waveguide" in the newer versions of the Uni-Q driver, the mid/treble integration has gotten much better. What's continued to hold me back from buying something like the LS is the limited soundstage, it usually seems to stop at the edges of the cabinets, a byproduct of the woofer cone acting as a large waveguide for the tweeter.

The Orb audio speakers are not particularly great either, there's a reason why they don't post even the most basic specs like FR because the results would be pretty ugly. What Gallo does best are their subwoofers and reference line speakers like the Strada and Ref 3.5.

Morel does little round speakers as well that are half decent, but when you make anything that small you are really fighting physics, you just can't expect that much out of them.
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ultrabike

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Re: The SHOW Newport Impressions - adding to the stream of consciousness.
« Reply #31 on: June 02, 2013, 07:01:52 AM »

How did you find the soundstage of the LS50? I've not been the biggest fan of KEF in the past, (XQ series in particular was disappointing despite the gorgeous looks) bit since they introduced their "tangerine waveguide" in the newer versions of the Uni-Q driver, the mid/treble integration has gotten much better. What's continued to hold me back from buying something like the LS is the limited soundstage, it usually seems to stop at the edges of the cabinets, a byproduct of the woofer cone acting as a large waveguide for the tweeter.

I liked their soundstage quite a bit. I did stand outside of the edge of the cabinets and things weren't too bad. At some point things do start sounding weird, but relatively speaking, not bad at all.

The Orb audio speakers are not particularly great either, there's a reason why they don't post even the most basic specs like FR because the results would be pretty ugly. What Gallo does best are their subwoofers and reference line speakers like the Strada and Ref 3.5.

Morel does little round speakers as well that are half decent, but when you make anything that small you are really fighting physics, you just can't expect that much out of them.

Probably their subs were nice, but man those monitors were damn bright! There was another dude that said: These are very resolving... I was like, nah man those are really bright.

The Vanatoo where fairly small BTW, and IMO were very good!

[EDIT] My cheapo-deal-o Boston Acoustics MM220 have some very diminutive drivers, and surprised me with their performance. They distort, but those are very flat from 100 Hz to 20 kHz. I agree that single small drivers on a small enclosure will face a lot of hurdles...
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Anaxilus.

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Re: The SHOW Newport Impressions - adding to the stream of consciousness.
« Reply #32 on: June 02, 2013, 02:13:42 PM »

Have to agree w/ Ultra on a few things:

Vanatoo was quite good.  I was impressed by the sound for what it was.  I would say the Harbeth 30s had a more refined and resolving midrange and treble than the Vanatoo but the Harbeth's bass was seriously fucked up.

Gallo was bright, also seemed to have a metallic ringing from the housing or something, sound got thinned out the lower the freqs went till the Sub picked everything up down low.  That was V-shaped.  I saw the Strada and asked if they would set it up.  They said they would around two which was around when my special Magnepan demo was scheduled so that was perfect.  Came back and the Strada was as suspected fuller in the midrange but anything the little orbs were doing well in treble were completely gone in the Strada.  Still lacked in refinement compared to the Vanatoo, etc. 

Voxativ.  Ultra is being kind.  The new speakers kind of blow.  Vocals are hideous and treble unrefined.  More coherent w/ less horn discrepancy than last years Ampegios but those had awesome dynamcs, clarity, resolution, tone color, and realism albiet in a forward presentation w/ horn honk.  This new space saving cabinet is a step back.

Magnapan. Much better w/ the Theta front end than the Bryston stuff from CES.  However, still nothing really special.  I think I'm just not a e-stat/ribbon guy.  There's just a missing sense of depth and body to imaging or rendering of instruments/notes that gets to me.  The edges of images never seem to completely render a sharp delineation where the image is 'completed'.  Sort of fades around the edges into air.  It's clean and clear with being muddy or congested but it's like the edges of images smear into air instead of cutting off sharply finishing the picture.  It's just not the same true to life sound I get from YG and Venture where notes sound real and present rather than wafting though space and time.  For a poor analogy, imagine Rembrandt versus Monet.  Enough about my stat psychosis.  That being said...

Sanders-Tari asked me to check them out and you know what, glad I did!  My favorite planar loudspeaker yet.  More than Martin Logan, Magnepan, King Sound.  Now, all of them present a stat sound as I described my hearing of it.  But if you like that, then these Sanders are damned good.  Big, dynamic, clear, detailed.  There was a bit of a hollowness behind the vocals but that seemed to change a bit if I went into a half standing position rather than seated.  Of course they are quite directional so that's to be considered. 

MBL-These guys had SS width down, nobody else got that wide.  I can see truth to Andy's comments about performers being right there in that room.  Sound was pretty good but I had a few issues.  Treble had a bit of a splashiness to it and the overall signature lacked refinement to me.  That added hint of grain or harshness in texture that distracts from the true to life sense that sucks you in and keeps you there.  Imaging that was pretty good on slower paced acoustics fell apart on Hotel California and everything started to blend together.

MSB-Analog DAC sounded really good!  However, that set of YGs either was not as good as the Sonjas or the MSB amps are the problem.  Apart from the DAC, didn't like the rest too much, it was ok.  If only I could take the Analog DAC to the Tenor room and hot swap it w/ the Luxman D-06 to see what happens.

Coffman Labs-My third favorite room at the SHOW.  Some of the best vinyl I heard on a rig that was reasonably priced compared to the usual suspects.  Driven by two Manley Monoblocks running paralleled 300Bs and 6SN7s (Neoclassic 300B?  Chassis looked like a new design.).  Wonderfully clear, neutral and reso lving like all good tubes amps should be.  Probably some of the least colored sounding 300B amps I've heard, including their 300B preamp.  Love Manley amps.  One of my top 5 favorite amp builders.  Ask to hear their Paganini vinyl by Michael Rabin!

Tenor/YG-Went back to hear them again 2 more times.  I listened to this room 4 times total, still love it.  Not perfect, but does a lot right for me.

Venture-My god, favorite room overall.  Ran into purrin and took him for a listen.  I think we could have just stayed there and kept listening to whatever they played all day.  Probably came back to this room 7 times.
____

Abyss-Meh.  Had trouble w/ the treble on both pairs and phone seemed slower and less articulate than the HD800.  I just don't accept any planar at that level lacking that much proficiency.  My HE5 sounded faster as well.  I didn't hear anything from the Abyss I can't already get from Hifiman or Audeze (when working as intended).  I heard the signature treble harshness on both Myteks, they sounded the same.  If anything, I suspect the excellent bass performance in the other room was a combination of the Mytek being bass light as well as Alisson Krauss being bass light as well, this enhances a sense of low end articulation.  Purrin and myself listen at different volumes too.  I'm louder so I probably noticed more treble issues on both Mytek/Abyss combos.

Malvalve-it's okay, pretty decent I guess.  Hard to tell as you read on.  Nothing special in any area, nothing horribly offensive either, though I'd prefer a more refined signature and definitely better technicalities for the price.  There are better dynamic ans stat amps to be had.  The best argument I can see is if you want an all in one device.  I used the LC2, LCD3, HE5, HD800, ESP50 on it. I will say it had a DACMini feeding it, and the HD800 picked out the DAC's issues clearly so that may have had quite a bit to do w/ it the Malvalves signature.  Can't say how much it would scale w/ better upstream, could be better still.  Also, the 950 got close to running out of gain on it.  Ran it at -1 to -2 for good volume.  HD800 was -30 to -35.  It does sound better than the E90 box that comes w/ the 950, better than the 323 as well.  Definitely a better amp than anything Hifiman or ALO had there.

ALO desktop tube amp w/ 4 HOs.  Meh, a bit rough around the edges sounding.  Tried the RX3b again single ended this time w/ UERM.  Honestly, I did not find the hiss to be that bad or intrusive on my setup.  If other options don't pan out, I might consider trying to live with it for a bit.

Hifiman-EF6-Attenuator sucks, not enough steps, clunky as hell.  Sound is bright as hell w/ the HD800 modded even.  Much more neutral w/ the HE6 but not particularly resolving or special.  DO NOT use this amp w/ the HD800!  Ouch! 

RE600-sounds like a better RE400 to me that's more neutral.  Still on the warm signature side, slight veil as well.  Still think the 272 is better if only it had better bass response.

Vendor space for the Headphonium was very limited which is why I believe some couldn't make it.  They sold out of space.


Had two 7 hour days there in a row, think I'm done.  Was planning on being done at 2 today but that tunred into 6.  Overall, w/ the exception one dealer, every room I went to was very cordial and open to using my own tracks as long as they had the hardware.  This was an improvement over last year when some dealers were down right obstinate.  I made sure to have my tracks ready on sdcard, CD, and usb flash drive.  I did get stumped by the Sanders room which was using compact flash?!

Good to see the headphone guys there too!  Jason and M ike from Schiit was great as usual (Mike seemed sober today, which is weird).  Alex from Audeze was fantastic, despite our tendency to be quite critical here, he has always been incredibly enthusiastic to ask for our feedback.  ALO...umm, why do you bring a balanced RX3b amp to a show w/o the proper adapter cables?  Don't they make cables too?  Folks at Hifiman were great too!  Good to see Michael Goodman from CENtrance again, maker of the first standalone DAC (Port) I ever bought!


Oh yeah, there was this Tyll guy I finally met for the first time.  Meh...     ;) :-*


« Last Edit: June 02, 2013, 03:54:29 PM by Analixus »
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munch

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Re: The SHOW Newport Impressions - adding to the stream of consciousness.
« Reply #33 on: June 02, 2013, 02:29:38 PM »

well that's pretty much what I was expecting (and hoping for) from RE-600... I really do like RE-272, but it was missing a bit of bass indeed. so... I think I can't go wrong with the RE-600!

now the waiting time starts... thanks
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Anaxilus.

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Re: The SHOW Newport Impressions - adding to the stream of consciousness.
« Reply #34 on: June 02, 2013, 03:18:07 PM »

Oh, the worst part of attending these shows?  Feeling obligated to stay after they play your demo track even though you know the system failed it after the first twenty seconds.  Especially after the room fills up and now you have to wait six minutes to politely thank them and get your disc back.  I guess that's fair,often painful, but fair.  Can't say how much Hotel California I heard this weekend...... :-00
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Tari

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Re: The SHOW Newport Impressions - adding to the stream of consciousness.
« Reply #35 on: June 02, 2013, 03:46:34 PM »

Heard the same Venture setup at Axpona and had the same reaction.  Too bad they're as expensive as they are.  Glad you liked the Sanders room, when I asked him why he uses such crappy sources he said it was to show how well his system ran even with a source that wasn't "hifi" and how good pro sources can actually be.  Good to know the Analog DAC is worth listening to, I really wish MSB's add-on prices weren't bordering on usury.


How loud was the MBL room?  I've really enjoyed it when they play the top of the line (their new mid-line is comparatively awful) but their rooms have always been super loud and its hard to judge just how detailed and layered they would be if played at normal volumes.  I think thats also where the grain comes in, due to how loud they're driving (oftentimes old) source recordings.  Hearing Marley on those MBL's was the first time I really had fun listening to reggae.
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Tari

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Re: The SHOW Newport Impressions - adding to the stream of consciousness.
« Reply #36 on: June 02, 2013, 03:51:59 PM »

For those interested in the KEF LS50, they have a show special of $1200.
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Tari

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Re: The SHOW Newport Impressions - adding to the stream of consciousness.
« Reply #37 on: June 02, 2013, 05:15:07 PM »

For those who heard the Empirical room (should have been a couple of you), I believe they showed with the new Vapor Nimbus:





Which looks really interesting at under 8K.  Any thoughts?
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blubliss

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Re: The SHOW Newport Impressions - adding to the stream of consciousness.
« Reply #38 on: June 02, 2013, 05:48:38 PM »

I was amazed how such large speakers could sound so small.  Room was awful to me.
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Tari

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Re: The SHOW Newport Impressions - adding to the stream of consciousness.
« Reply #39 on: June 02, 2013, 05:55:30 PM »

That sucks.  I really enjoyed the Seaton speakers at Axpona which used similar Acoustic Elegance drivers made here in Green Bay, was hoping a speaker utilizing their 15" TD15H would be a room-filler.  I didn't really like the Cirrus much but was hoping for more from the Nimbus.
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