CHANGSTAR: Audiophile Headphone Reviews and Early 90s Style BBS

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Author Topic: headphone power ... what do you need ?  (Read 5091 times)

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Solderdude

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Re: headphone power ... what do you need ?
« Reply #20 on: December 13, 2013, 10:53:37 AM »
do note that the mA are RMS values and to get the mA you really need to drive these headphones the value needs to be 1.4x higher.
Example: if a headphone consumes 40mA the amplifier needs to deliver +/- 57mA

Maybe I will add a dB/V row as well but the columns will be smaller.
Afterall that is just a calculation.

Somehow I like the idea of your list  :)p8
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Chris1967

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Re: headphone power ... what do you need ?
« Reply #21 on: December 13, 2013, 01:18:32 PM »
Hey Frans, very good idea, thanks!!

I posted this in another forum and someone claims the 90db power and the 120db columns should not be identical mW vs W... i argued that they are directly analogous x1000 but he disagreed... can you tell me what to tell him?

and he claims the AKG 340's are 400ohms not 350...
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Solderdude

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Re: headphone power ... what do you need ?
« Reply #22 on: December 13, 2013, 01:34:01 PM »
The K340 measurements of impedance are real values measured by Tyll.
http://www.innerfidelity.com/images/AKGK340Stock.pdf
I choose to believe that over specs in a brochure  ;)

You are correct, the difference between 90dB and 120dB = 30dB and 30dB in power is a factor 1000 and thus the numbers are the same but mW changes into Watt as there is a factor 1000 between them.

30dB in Voltage is merely a factor 31.6 difference, but as P=U2*R the factor in power is 1000  (31.6)2 as R is a constant.
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Chris1967

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Re: headphone power ... what do you need ?
« Reply #23 on: December 13, 2013, 01:55:32 PM »
Thank you Frans, i posted him your answer!!  :)p7
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Maxvla

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Re: headphone power ... what do you need ?
« Reply #24 on: December 15, 2013, 04:32:39 AM »
Tried to use your sheet to show the HE-6 crowd they are retarded, but they wouldn't listen at all, accusing me of starting myths that they don't actually need that 200W @8ohm power amp to drive headphones.  p:8


http://www.head-fi.org/t/565779/review-ray-samuels-audio-dark-star-solid-state-headphone-amplifier/330#post_10067060
Quote (selected)
Okay, all I know from my experience is that the Lyr, Mjolnir, EF-6, and Soloist (all of which I own or have owned) are not up to snuff with the HE-6.  I don't know if need a "megawatt vintage receiver", but to my ears, the power offered by the Darkstar can be considered "entry level" for the HE-6 (i.e., with it's power you can suddenly see why the HE-6 is considered one of the top two or three headphones around today).  I can only imagine that with a bit more power (e.g., 15 to 20 watts) it can only get better with this headphone.

Mind. Blown.
« Last Edit: December 15, 2013, 04:49:42 AM by Maxvla »
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Anaxilus.

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Re: headphone power ... what do you need ?
« Reply #25 on: December 15, 2013, 05:19:52 AM »
Most of them aren't even adding better sound through better drive capability.  IME, most of them are just coloring the phones w/ resistors to get a less offensive sound.
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Solderdude

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Re: headphone power ... what do you need ?
« Reply #26 on: December 15, 2013, 09:23:32 AM »
Quote from: Maxvla on December 15, 2013, 04:32:39 AM
Tried to use your sheet to show the HE-6 crowd they are retarded, but they wouldn't listen at all, accusing me of starting myths that they don't actually need that 200W @8ohm power amp to drive headphones.  p:8

Mind. Blown.

It is not by coincidence I did not register at HF nor Hydrogen  ::)



The table above is for headphones rated for 3W to 6W (the HE6 is rated 6W)

The whole article containing more tables, for different power rating headphones, and calculating resistor divider networks is on my website under: Technical explanations | Power amp adapter.

Of course even if calculated to max power (which is more a protective measure for the headphones) in a lot of cases real usable values might have to be more 'conservative' because noise levels and usable volpot range might be too high if calculated only for max power rating.
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funkmeister

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Re: headphone power ... what do you need ?
« Reply #27 on: December 16, 2013, 01:51:27 PM »
Am I reading this right, that the HE-6 hits its power handling limit (6W) at ~96.5dB and it takes about 17.3V to do it?

Oh my will that be a disappointment to people... except for the fact that it's known to handle way beyond that limit in spurts.
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Solderdude

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Re: headphone power ... what do you need ?
« Reply #28 on: December 16, 2013, 03:25:36 PM »
the HE-6 is 76dB/mW and 90dB/V  I have no idea where HiFiman gets their 83dB spec from ...  :-S
In my table the correct efficiency was used for the calculations but the 'official' number was in the dB/mW table.

This is corrected now.

20mW will give you 90dB and 0.6W will give 105dB 20W will be needed for 120dB
The HE-6 will give 114 dB at 6W but will easily handle higher peaks if they are short.

You will need 17V indeed.

When connected to a power amp that can deliver 40W into 8 Ohm (= 75W into 4 Ohm amp) you will be able to reach the 6W
« Last Edit: December 17, 2013, 07:10:13 PM by Solderdude »
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xnor

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Re: headphone power ... what do you need ?
« Reply #29 on: December 16, 2013, 05:11:54 PM »
I think 110 dB SPL peak is a reasonable target to aim for.

With that *many* headphones do not even need any or just very little gain with a 2 Vrms source, yet some headphone manufacturers insist on high gain. All this results in is worse performance.
Quite a couple of headphones would actually "need" negative gain...


If you listen to highly compressed modern music you don't want to go above 95 dB SPL peak, unless you're into hearing damage.
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