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Author Topic: DTS Headphone:X ????  (Read 6967 times)

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Tyll Hertsens

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Re: DTS Headphone:X ????
« Reply #40 on: June 21, 2013, 05:25:41 PM »

Oh! Yes, changes in virtual speaker location with head movement on the realizer and other similar devices do play a big role in strengthening the out-of-head illusion. Studies have shown that front-to-back reversals (when you think a sound is coming from behind but it's actually coming from in front, and vice versa) happen ten times more often if the head is clamped and prevented from moving.

One thing I thought about the Headphone-X thing being primarily thought of as a tablet/phone product by DTS, is that they may be able to use the facial recognition software already on such devices to determine head movement. Just a wild ass thought though.
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Re: DTS Headphone:X ????
« Reply #41 on: June 21, 2013, 06:44:59 PM »

I've given up on new "technologies" like this. To me, they are just gimmicks in hopes of earning an extra buck. I sometimes wonder if these DSP engineers understand how the ear and mastering actually work.

I don't want to be an apologist for corporate R&D departments, but I wouldn't be too quick to cheapen their work with words like "gimmick" and "extra buck". Yeah, I think they live in a different world, and yeah, I think they get lead around by the nose by "the body of research (that often sucks)" or by marketing departments that don't know the real line between fantasy and what can actually be pulled off. But the guys working on this stuff (based on my experience in the past with Sennheiser and recent trips to Harman and DTS) are very well informed and up to speed on the problems and how difficult they are to solve.

I think we suffer from "group think" on these issues as well, and sometimes think the we've got special knowledge that others "aren't getting". The truth, however, is more along the lines of everybody fumbling around as best they can in a fuster cluck of human endeavor.  Our heads (the royal "our" meaning everybody involved) are way ahead of what we can actually make appear in the market. So what looks like a gimmick is really just a small step in the right direction, but it's a very small step....to small to be worth much on its own.



Bottom line: pschoacoustics are tough. They're bound to fumble around for quite a while solving the problems. And until they do, their products will sound like gimmicks. But I'll betcha that as manufacturers make better headphones, and as folks like DTS put a create a corporate demand for headphones that perform well, we'll start seeing things like Headphone-X working better and better.

Yeah. I see your point and actually agree.

I guess I just wrote my comment in a piss-poor mood so it came off as negative.

While I don't know the gents at DTS or Senn, I've just grown tired of all the different implementations they have come up with over the years, with many not working very well at all. The Realizer is the only implementation of headphone surround sound that I have found to actually work. All others (except for well recorded binaural and holophonic recordings) fall by the side.

I do hope this research continues and that it eventually delivers something that actually works.
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Re: DTS Headphone:X ????
« Reply #42 on: June 21, 2013, 07:21:06 PM »


One thing I thought about the Headphone-X thing being primarily thought of as a tablet/phone product by DTS, is that they may be able to use the facial recognition software already on such devices to determine head movement. Just a wild ass thought though.

And then from there it could network to all nearby smart devices, determine location and orientation of everyone nearby, sync up all the microphones and noise sources, and recreate the sound environment. We'd never have to take off our headphones ever again. That's halfway to big brother right there...
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Re: DTS Headphone:X ????
« Reply #43 on: June 21, 2013, 07:49:43 PM »

Hey, if I can write an extremely good crossfeed DSP, which takes care of 90+% of room virtualization as long as you have decently neutral headphones (say, modified diffuse field or close), then it stands to reason that these companies are either wasting their time and money or actually stealing venture capital. Seriously.
If anyone is interested, I have the source code on hand.
The other 10% is precise equalization and a good convolution reverb, preferably true stereo.

The main difference is that standard crossfeed can only simulate front channels and center.
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Re: DTS Headphone:X ????
« Reply #44 on: June 22, 2013, 01:29:59 AM »

Listening to Depeche Mode Violator SACD ISO 6 channel. Downmixing in J River MC to 2 channel. Actually not a bad implementation of the downmixing algorithm. It's also a good production (mix / mastering) too.
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