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Author Topic: TF10 = UERM?; A case against the pseudo objective crowd  (Read 12013 times)

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Sforza

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Re: TF10 = UERM?; A case against the pseudo objective crowd
« Reply #10 on: June 15, 2013, 07:33:41 PM »
Quote from: DigitalFreak on June 15, 2013, 04:35:26 AM
I recently witnessed a blowup involving measurements on the head-fi SM64 thread. Does Inks do thiis sort of stuff often.

I saw that too. I'm surprised he stopped; maybe the mods gave him a warning? I'm surprised he hasn't been banned yet. Some of the assumptions he made on that thread were insane, especially the "measurements not up to standards = automatic bad sound" argument. He sounds like Rin's evil sock puppet.

Quote from: thegunner100 on June 15, 2013, 11:18:17 AM
You really do get the feeling that Rin doesn't actually listen to the headphones/IEMs that he measures. @purrin, awesome! Though I feel that the paradox is a superior headphone, I find myself preferring the hd600.

Same here. I prefer the HD600 because of its genre versatility, and the issues with getting a perfect fit and seal on the Paradox.
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Helios

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Re: TF10 = UERM?; A case against the pseudo objective crowd
« Reply #11 on: June 15, 2013, 08:49:47 PM »
Thanks for the info, tomscy2000.

I believe your spreadsheet is more accurate. There is some stuff near the bottom of the list that I *know* is more accurate on your sheet versus the other.
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anetode

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Re: TF10 = UERM?; A case against the pseudo objective crowd
« Reply #12 on: June 15, 2013, 09:10:45 PM »
It's not entirely fair to group Rin and Inks together on this. Inks' emotionally charged crusade is of a "shit on everything and everyone" sort based on someone else's research. There's no real skepticism there, only the defensive projection of a self-appointed apostle. To put it bluntly.

Rin is considerably more skeptical in his approach. It's true that as his blog has matured that he has become more confident and curt in his analyses. That trajectory is not dissimilar to any other reviewer as they accumulate experience. I suspect that if he kept a blog of impressions without delving into measurements and technical analyses that no one would even bat an eye.

That's not the case though, Rin's measurements are his bread and butter. He has come up with a set of standards for judging performance and build quality. These are not necessarily congruent with industry standards or with the techniques and conclusions of other reviewers/techs. I'm for a greater variety of approaches in the DIY measurement community, so I do not see Rin's site as some sort of plague upon the headphone community.

Where he is wrong he deserves to get called out, like with this UERM/TF10 business. Thank you anax & tomscy for providing contrary evidence. There could still be some unresolved mistakes in his analyses. I think that Rin would welcome an opportunity to address them if they are brought to his attention.
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Anaxilus.

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Re: TF10 = UERM?; A case against the pseudo objective crowd
« Reply #13 on: June 16, 2013, 09:50:59 AM »
I think it is fair.  Some of Rin's claims are quite lacking in objectivity and are logical leaps.  Poor logic or zealous emotion, essentially distinctions w/o a difference here when the claims are the same.  I'm not invalidating ALL on Rins' data or ALL of his analyses.  Just the more obvious logical leaps and some of the personally targeted remarks that seem quite condescending and self-serving.  That's what people need to watch out for.  Readers have a nasty tendency to read the printed word and set the authors up on a pedestal as authorities when their arguments or claims extend beyond the scope of their actual data or evidence.  I blame lazy readers and thinkers as much, if not more than Inks or Rin.  It's their support or lack of calling them out that allows this sort of all-knowing behavior/attitude to perpetuate.  Such attitudes are not conducive to proper science or progress.  I mean, for the love of all that is holy, I'd love to know what database and algorithms Rin established to reverse engineer LFF's mods w/o opening them based on a single set of measurements.  That's some powerful shit, maybe he should be working on political campaigns instead making 7 figures.

It's another shame, just like Harold.  People of reason and science should be working together and that involves openness and understanding, not absolutes.  Science isn't Fascist!
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Kunlun

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Re: TF10 = UERM?; A case against the pseudo objective crowd
« Reply #14 on: June 16, 2013, 02:22:49 PM »
Inks has been pretty weird with emotional crusades for a while.

He once accused me of bias in a review which it later turned out he had never read...

The crazy thing was he wouldn't back down about it even when he admitted he hadn't read it. Facts don't seem to convey the same thing to his mind that it does to ours.
« Last Edit: June 16, 2013, 02:37:14 PM by Kunlun »
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PhoenixClaw

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Re: TF10 = UERM?; A case against the pseudo objective crowd
« Reply #15 on: June 16, 2013, 04:12:02 PM »
I think Rin is getting too carried away (his twitter taunts to various manufacturers) because of the attention his blog is receiving (all those links to his graphs must have shown a spike in hits). I value what he does for this hobby - the measurements. Since we don't really have a system of checks and balances, it would be great to "peer review" stuff every once in a while. I believe we ALL want the best performance at the best prices.  No one really should be placed on a pedestal anyway.
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planx

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Re: TF10 = UERM?; A case against the pseudo objective crowd
« Reply #16 on: June 16, 2013, 06:50:27 PM »
Even though I don't exactly support what he does, he certainly springs some liveliness in the hobby. For most lurkers, like myself, it's quite entertaining to see how much of a fool he is making of himself at given times.
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jGray91

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Re: TF10 = UERM?; A case against the pseudo objective crowd
« Reply #17 on: June 17, 2013, 02:19:15 PM »
Quote from: PhoenixClaw on June 16, 2013, 04:12:02 PM
I think Rin is getting too carried away (his twitter taunts to various manufacturers) because of the attention his blog is receiving (all those links to his graphs must have shown a spike in hits). I value what he does for this hobby - the measurements. Since we don't really have a system of checks and balances, it would be great to "peer review" stuff every once in a while. I believe we ALL want the best performance at the best prices.  No one really should be placed on a pedestal anyway.

Speaking of peer review, how often does purrin did this to his own measurement setup? I'm not trying to be rude; sorry if it sounds like I am.
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shipsupt

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Re: TF10 = UERM?; A case against the pseudo objective crowd
« Reply #18 on: June 17, 2013, 02:56:32 PM »
How often does he do what, a peer review?
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Yeah, well, you know, that's just, like, your opinion, man.

PhoenixClaw

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Re: TF10 = UERM?; A case against the pseudo objective crowd
« Reply #19 on: June 17, 2013, 03:03:24 PM »
Quote from: jGray91 on June 17, 2013, 02:19:15 PM

Speaking of peer review, how often does purrin did this to his own measurement setup? I'm not trying to be rude; sorry if it sounds like I am.

I think it was stated before that he keeps his rig private save for a privileged few (not too sure) for personal reasons, but purrin himself will be the best to tell you.
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