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Author Topic: Re: What To Do If You Don't "Like A Thing"  (Read 6341 times)

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lachlanlikesathing

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Re: Re: What To Do If You Don't "Like A Thing"
« Reply #90 on: May 09, 2015, 11:08:53 PM »
Quote from: purr1n on May 09, 2015, 10:18:54 PM
"autism" vs. "retardation": political correctness taken too far can cause harm by setting unrealistic expectations. I know most of you are not parents, so probably more difficult for you to grasp.

Part of what you're describing just seems like the 'euphemism treadmill' where the terms of a formal medical diagnosis gradually become stigmatised and used as insults, so over time the medical community drops them and tries to find more specific terms that avoid that stigma. No Doctor wants to tell a parent that their child is retarded when it sounds like the same as a playground taunt, it just seems unprofessional. And then the cycle repeats.

So like, say, calling someone 'dumb', a 'moron', or an 'imbecile'. Now 'retarded' is coming out of vogue, and autism is actually being increasingly used on the internet just as a general insult to people with poor social skills. Terms like autard or hugbox or the like.

Of course mixed in with that is all sorts of ambiguity and misinformation about high functioning autism and low functioning autism (not even sure those are the current terms anymore.) There was a really great story on a Radiolab episode that featured two sides of the debate you are bringing up. One is the story of a person who seems to have had a lot of their severely autistic behaviours improved after a kind of 'therapy', and the other side is a parent of a severely autistic child who gets upset by what he sees as the tremendously unrealistic expectations that you mention.

I'll admit that despite having a friend on the autistic spectrum I didn't really connect with some of the issues in autism advocacy he was talking about until I heard stories like this.


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AustinValentine

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Re: Re: What To Do If You Don't "Like A Thing"
« Reply #91 on: May 09, 2015, 11:18:45 PM »
Going to keep out of this for the most part, but I do want to interject one thing: only around 40% of individuals with Autism spectrum disorders have any degree of cognitive impairment (See: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21272389, recent commentaries on this study have adjusted the percentage of individuals with intellectual disabilities down to around 40%. Being conservative, you could say that there is a 50/50 split). Only a quarter (25%) of the overall population have any level of verbal-level cognitive impairment outside of not being able to understand language pragmatics. The traditional ideal of the "locked in" ASD individual is only partially accurate. The generalization presents a large barrier to improved educational, workplace, and home-life conditions for the other 60-75% of ASD individuals. If you search the web, you'll find this conflict playing out in the battle between charities that forward a disease pathology model of autism (i.e. Autism Speaks) and those that take a neurodiversity approach to autism (i.e. The Autism Self Advocacy Network).

There has been a massive rash of over-diagnosis of ASD's though, especially among the young male population. (At the same time, there is likely a large scale under-diagnosis of ASD's among young girls.) Most doctors who do the diagnosing have never read any of Hans Asperger's initial research on children that underpinned the clinical diagnostic criteria - so almost any social developmental disorder gets dropped into that category these days.

IMO this is not the worst thing that could happen though. Most of the time, the same types of social skills therapy and applied behavior analysis is the exact same type of treatment for non-ASD social developmental disorders as for ASD ones. Without the overly-broad umbrella diagnoses that we have at the moment, there wouldn't be as much access to treatment for children with non-ASD social developmental disorders.

We now return you to your regularly scheduled nitpicking, already in progress.

P.S. Chromebook is still winning.
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lachlanlikesathing

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Re: Re: What To Do If You Don't "Like A Thing"
« Reply #92 on: May 09, 2015, 11:30:46 PM »
Quote from: AustinValentine on May 09, 2015, 11:18:45 PM
If you search the web, you'll find this conflict playing out in the battle between charities that forward a disease pathology model of autism (i.e. Autism Speaks) and those that take a neurodiversity approach to autism (i.e. The Autism Self Advocacy Network).

This is one of those issues I have discussions about with my friends. I understand people with high functioning autism make tremendous contributions to society, and there are plenty of historical figures that seem like they would have been diagnosed as on the spectrum today. So a pathology model seems a little inappropriate if instead we could just make more opportunities for autistic people to contribute. As Temple Grandin suggests, many make great programmers among other things.

At the same time its hard for me to imagine how this will work for people with severe low functioning autism, who need constant care and supervision. To me it seems like approaching low functioning autism as a severe impairment that we should try and 'cure' doesn't seem unreasonable.

 Of course I can understand why that's upsetting, given the history of other social behaviours that were once considered medical pathologies.
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Marvey

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Re: What To Do If You Don't "Like A Thing"
« Reply #93 on: May 10, 2015, 12:37:45 AM »
This is exactly why I prefer "retard" and "autistic". An autistic individual (an odd or weird person, but an with IQ over 140) might be able to be a computer programmer. A retard will never be able to be a computer programmer.


Matt Damon the Retard



The Real Rain Man
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Ringingears

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Re: What To Do If You Don't "Like A Thing"
« Reply #94 on: May 10, 2015, 01:21:12 AM »
Just read this entire thread. This is why I enjoy this community. Open discussion. Some day I will write a paper on my experiences watching teens deal with all these issues. All I can add to the discussion is that the pain that people feel is real and deep. It causes depression and worse if not addressed. My impression is that everyone just wants to be treated as a respected human being. Not privileged. Surely much too simple. And speaking person to person is a much better form of communication than all the written words one could type.
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Marvey

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Re: What To Do If You Don't "Like A Thing"
« Reply #95 on: May 10, 2015, 01:26:46 AM »
I'm sure if I grew up under the care of today's helicopter parents, I would have a very negative self-image from being labeled as suffering from autism, ADD, and Tourette's syndrome. Might have even suffered from brain chemical imbalances from the drugs I would be prescribed.
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Ringingears

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Re: What To Do If You Don't "Like A Thing"
« Reply #96 on: May 10, 2015, 01:41:40 AM »
Oh Marv,
The drugs. What a nightmare. People that need them don't get them and IMHO too many are put on them for normal child behavioral "issues". And yes you definitely would be diagnosed with some syndrome.  :)p13. Most of the pirates here would be.

 And helicopter parents are the other. I'm waiting for one of them to buy a drone and fly it over their kid all day monitoring.  I could write a book. Maybe I will. I don't dare until I retire.

Then their is the other end of things. I call the MIA parents.
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Anaxilus

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Re: What To Do If You Don't "Like A Thing"
« Reply #97 on: May 10, 2015, 02:05:33 AM »
So someone explain to me how political correctness isn't the mother of all helicopter parents. Let's just take one of the worst parenting models and apply it to society at large. Friggin' brilliant  idea. Hello USA 2015.
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Nekonokira

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Re: Re: What To Do If You Don't "Like A Thing"
« Reply #98 on: May 10, 2015, 02:30:48 AM »
Quote from: purr1n on May 10, 2015, 01:26:46 AM
I'm sure if I grew up under the care of today's helicopter parents, I would have a very negative self-image from being labeled as suffering from autism, ADD, and Tourette's syndrome. Might have even suffered from brain chemical imbalances from the drugs I would be prescribed.

If I would have had parents who actually care, I might have gotten my diagnosis a decade earlier which would have made a lot of things easier.

I think as a parent you need to find a line between over hysterical and not giving a shit.
My mother never liked the idea of not having a well developing child. When I told her how I felt she just laughed, always being above everyone else and when I tried to argue she cried making me feel like a ungrateful child.

Things only got kicking because of my teachers at school. Of course when confronted my mom told them I'm just a little shy, but never talking with anyone and staying hidden in the toilet until next class isn't quite normal.

But now I can actually get a job, because I'm declared as handicapped. I don't have to prove anything I can't, I'm happy and I can actually live a life.

Of course things that happened shape a person but I wouldn't want another kid to go through the same totally unnecessary trouble only because their parents think they don't need take responsibillity over the thing that came out of their womb.
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Ringingears

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Re: What To Do If You Don't "Like A Thing"
« Reply #99 on: May 10, 2015, 02:32:58 AM »
Honestly, for me "political correctness" is such a moving target, I am not sure what it really means anymore. If common courtesy, respect, and communicating using a mature and civil tone and honesty are included in PC, then I have to say my experience with helicopter parents has been anything but PC. In fact it has been rude, abusive, threatening, obnoxious and dishonest for the most part. Especially the last few years.  I am thinking we may just have a different concept of the term "helicopter parents". 
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