Topic: USB cleaner, purifiers, decrapifiers? (Read 9646 times)

AustinValentine · « **Reply #10 on:** August 21, 2015, 03:04:10 PM »

A quick chime in here. My experiences here are with the Schiit Wyrd.

I started using USB power improvement devices after I realized that my ODAC and Gamma2 sometimes sounded better hooked up via OTG to my Note 2 than it did via USB to my rMBP.

I had had problems with powered peripherals on my Macbook previously (USB hubs shutting down, Thunderbolt-connected monitors not waking from sleep, etc.). The culprit with the peripheral problems was always the Macbook System Management Controller (SMC). Intel-based Apple SMCs are far too aggressive in attempting to conserve power output for battery life and thermal concerns. This isn't without good reason: Apple products have a long and illustrious history of heat dissipation failures that result in early logic board death.

Sure enough, if I started my music and the sound seemed off, doing a restart + left shift-control-option to reset the controller would result in audibly better sound after the reset. I put a Schiit Wyrd in chain not to get some sort of improvement from the Decrapifier itself but to try to make up for the power management problems inherent in Apple's laptop design. It did this job perfectly fine - but I assume that any decent powered hub would have done that as well.

All that said, over time it has seemed to me that the Wyrd causes improvement on the ODAC & Gamma2 (and eventually the Modi 2 Uber and Schiit Gungnir as well) above and beyond just fixing the USB power issue. Across all of these DACs, there was a kind of tightening up of the sound that happened with the Wyrd in chain. This "tightening up" of the sound gets referred to around here as the "turbo clock effect". Generally, the turbo clock effect is a good thing but it isn't always the case. The Wyrd + Geek Out 450 combo seemed to sound worse to my ears.

I'm pretty skeptical about cable improvements and I haven't heard much benefit or difference there. The only times I'm sure that I heard sonic differences from cables have been when the cable had extra resistance (like the stock cable on the Fidelio X1, for example) or some other obvious problem (the early three button mic cables packaged with the V-Moda M-80 could really fuck up the sound). I do hear some real, substantial differences with the Wyrd though - so much so that I've dropped some money on ordering the Uptone Regen to see if there is any further improvement.

AllanMarcus · « **Reply #11 on:** August 21, 2015, 03:42:56 PM »

Thanks AustinValentine. Please keep us posted, and any A/B testing (preferably blind) is also appreciated.

On a scale of 1 to 10, ten being replacing beats headphones with LCD-3's and 1 being no audible change, how much change in sound do you think you hear in your best case scenario?

Hands · « **Reply #12 on:** August 21, 2015, 04:11:37 PM »

Wyrd seemed to tighten up and focus the sound from my various USB->SPDIF converters into my Model S DAC. With my latest SPDIF transport (CI Audio Transient Mk2), it sort of tipped it over the edge to the point where it was almost an edgy, unpleasant sound, so I removed it from the chain. Not a mind blowing difference by any means, and most reports indicate Wyrd has positive effects. Just a few reports where some gear is better left without it. Wyrd is definitely good if you have a crappy USB port.

burnspbesq · « **Reply #13 on:** August 21, 2015, 04:59:45 PM »

I use a iFi iUSB in my office system, where I have a four meter USB cable running from the hub built into my monitor to a Resonessence Concero. The improvement in performance from having cleaner power was immediately apparent when I first put it into the system over two years ago. Lower noise floor, more realistic transients, and probably a few other things I'm forgetting.

At some point I may try an Uptone or a couple of JitterBug's in the home-office system, but I consider that "nice to do" rather than "must do" because the Hilo doesn't use the USB power for anything. We'll see.

ohhgourami · « **Reply #14 on:** August 21, 2015, 05:05:05 PM »

Heard small but noticeable improvement with the Wyrd on my audio-gd NFB7.32. A bit less grain and better timing.

Just bought a jcat so we will see what kind of improvement there will be from that.

DaveBSC · « **Reply #15 on:** August 21, 2015, 05:14:31 PM »

Quote from: Armaegis on August 21, 2015, 06:48:37 AM

Wow that jcat card costs more than my computer

Yep, definitely not cheap. In my experience though, an off the shelf DC powered Atom/Celeron J/N board with the JCAT card will match or exceed the performance of commercial music servers/streamers costing up to at least $2500 or so. A much more affordable option is the PPA Studio USB card. The standard version with a TCXO clock is $129, and there's also a new upgraded version with a MUCH larger oven controlled clock for $429.

http://ppaproduct.blogspot.tw/2013/07/audio-grade-usb-30-pcie-card.html

DaveBSC · « **Reply #16 on:** August 21, 2015, 05:18:50 PM »

Quote from: AllanMarcus on August 21, 2015, 12:59:19 PM

Great set of answers. Many thanks. My MB also has optical (toslink) out, and I've tried that too. While I cannot hear a difference between my USB and my TOSLink, in theory, is one better than the other?

While Toslink has immunity from EMI/RF, it's a very high jitter interface. Some motherboard ports are worse than others, but none of them could be described as "good." Toslink's support for sample rates above 96kHz is also iffy at best, while USB has no problem with 384kHz+ PCM and 5.6MHz+ DSD.

AllanMarcus · « **Reply #17 on:** August 21, 2015, 05:48:26 PM »

Quote from: DaveBSC on August 21, 2015, 05:18:50 PM

While Toslink has immunity from EMI/RF, it's a very high jitter interface. Some motherboard ports are worse than others, but none of them could be described as "good." Toslink's support for sample rates above 96kHz is also iffy at best, while USB has no problem with 384kHz+ PCM and 5.6MHz+ DSD.

OK, interesting. Since I listen at CD quality and have a very short TOSLink cable (3 ft), I imagine jitter is not an issue for me. In fact, I thought jitter only because an issue with TOSLink cables for long runs.

DaveBSC · « **Reply #18 on:** August 21, 2015, 06:24:30 PM »

Quote from: AllanMarcus on August 21, 2015, 05:48:26 PM

OK, interesting. Since I listen at CD quality and have a very short TOSLink cable (3 ft), I imagine jitter is not an issue for me. In fact, I thought jitter only because an issue with TOSLink cables for long runs.

Nope. The jitter from Toslink comes from the electrical/optical and optical/electrical conversions that must take place at both ends of the cable. The length of the cable itself is largely irrelevant. The length of a coax S/Pdif cable matters because of signal reflections, around 1.5M is generally considered ideal at 75 Ohms.

AustinValentine · « **Reply #19 on:** August 21, 2015, 07:00:55 PM »

Quote from: AllanMarcus on August 21, 2015, 03:42:56 PM

Thanks AustinValentine. Please keep us posted, and any A/B testing (preferably blind) is also appreciated.

On a scale of 1 to 10, ten being replacing beats headphones with LCD-3's and 1 being no audible change, how much change in sound do you think you hear in your best case scenario?

As most people said after, the difference is pretty subtle but noticeable.

Also, my experience with Macbook Toslink hasn't been very good. I'm using a 2012 15" rMBP and the toslink is harsh, grainy, and altogether unsuitable as an audio connection. To put it in context - for shits and giggles I purchased a PurePiper USB SPDIF converter* off of eBay and even that was a pretty large across the board upgrade from the rMBP Toslink when used with vintage DACs and the Gamma2. I don't know if all Macbook Toslink is that poor but the one in my unit sure as hell is.

____________________________
* It's a generic converter that goes by a dozen different brand names. Like this: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Purepiper-HIFI-USB-to-S-PDIF-convertor-External-Sound-Card-Audio-Card-/161728454999?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item25a7c46157&nma=true&si=ADVZW%252Fsnew%252F10%252FU2l9bYbkG0voQ%253D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2557 , but I paid $4.00 for it after S&H. It's far, far worse than even a Gustard U12 and shouldn't even be mentioned in the same sentence as the Melodious MX-U8 or Jkenny Ciunas Converter.

Author Topic: USB cleaner, purifiers, decrapifiers? (Read 9646 times)

AustinValentine

Re: USB cleaner, purifiers, decrapifiers?

AllanMarcus

Re: USB cleaner, purifiers, decrapifiers?

Hands

Re: USB cleaner, purifiers, decrapifiers?

burnspbesq

Re: USB cleaner, purifiers, decrapifiers?

ohhgourami

Re: USB cleaner, purifiers, decrapifiers?

DaveBSC

Re: USB cleaner, purifiers, decrapifiers?

DaveBSC

Re: USB cleaner, purifiers, decrapifiers?

AllanMarcus

Re: USB cleaner, purifiers, decrapifiers?

DaveBSC

Re: USB cleaner, purifiers, decrapifiers?

AustinValentine

Re: USB cleaner, purifiers, decrapifiers?

(adsbygoogle = window.adsbygoogle || []).push({});

Author Topic: USB cleaner, purifiers, decrapifiers? (Read 9646 times)