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Author Topic: Back to Speakers! And so it begins... again! Madisound BK-16 Fostex fe166 kit.  (Read 37270 times)

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Maxvla

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Really impressive, Marv.  Amazing sound on the relatively cheap.
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firev1

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The old type of audiophiles are rather stupid in a sense, they abhor PEQ and other DSP stuff but are somehow able to live with crappy drivers/resonances, we get them a lot in the headphone community as well.

That being said, thanks for elaborating on the AXO stuff, the only way I see that AXO is viable has always been on the digital side but none of the dacs are that great if they could do crossover splitting. Guess that in the interest of lower cost, will be sticking on the passive side of things for a while.

Great job purrin, very nice results. Would be fun to see CSDs if you can get anything meaningful though.
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DaveBSC

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Very nice work. One thing I've always wondered about is a wide-bander in a flow resistance enclosure, rather than a horn or traditional box type setup. Has anybody ever tried that? In theory at least, no crossover combined with the room nullifying effects of a FR enclosure with maybe a bit of EQ would be the best of all worlds, requiring little more than maybe a few corner traps where the FR effect doesn't work.
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Marvey

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I don't think anyone has tried that. These HE wide-banders tend to have very little x-max. I would worry that the flow-resistance enclosures are too close to open baffles - any cone I've seen mounted on a open baffle tends to have excursion like crazy. I know John K's Nao Note II RS uses H frames instead of straight open baffles (I don't know if he stuffed anything inside the back of the H frames), but this was only for the woofers.
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DaveBSC

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What I was thinking is something like an Omega Super 6 that would run full range from about 45ish Hz to 18Khz, in a flow resistance box to cancel out the side and rear wave. Two subs I guess with some bass traps or EQ or both could be used to fill in the bass response where FR enclosures don't work anyway. The one FR speaker I'm familiar with is the Krypton, which is a 3-way, with two 8" mid-woofers that work from 160-1200Hz. I don't know how much bass output the Super 6 would lose if the box was a FR instead of just ported.

I suppose one possibility would be two opt for a two-way setup, using a method like Reference 3A where the mid-bass driver is driven without a crossover, with a single cap acting as a high-pass filter.
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Marvey

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Yeah, the use of x2 8' drivers would work better. Much larger surface area than one tiny 6', so less excursion for each driver. I don't think a Super 6 type of design (one 6' cone) in a flow resistance enclosure (I guess it's similar to a U-frame with stuffing in the back) would work well at even moderate SPL. The ported boxes or even rear loaded horns really help load the cone to keep its excursion from going crazy.

Instead of x2 8' drivers (I am not a big fan of MTM designs), I could do x4 8' drivers in an stuffed U-frame with a super tweeter in the middle, and then lend off the bass duties to a woofer. Then again, Donald North could have beat me to it:



It's a great idea you have though Dave. Now you've gotten me excited. (P.S. Dammit, stop giving me ideas.)
« Last Edit: March 24, 2013, 09:01:38 PM by purrin »
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Marvey

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SYSTEM UPDATE:

BTW, on a related thought... I realized how dumb it was for me to notch the 30Hz room mode on the subwoofer DSP unit rather than in JRiver (where the EQ also affects the mains.) I have now implemented the 30Hz room resonance notch in JRiver. This also relieves the 6' Fostex drivers from trying to reproduce bass notes it couldn't reproduce in the first place (I'm sure the little driver was playing 60Hz and 90Hz tones - 2nd and 3rd order distortion - instead of 30Hz.) This seemed to have made a huge difference in the clarity of the driver and eliminated some odd noises from the horn (the horn is tuned to 50Hz, and the driver Fs is at 50Hz).

I tried doing the same with the 55Hz room mode, but in the end, I've decided to still let the mains handle it for better mains and sub integration. This may change once I get a better subwoofer in because the Hsu is not exactly a tight sounding sub.
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Maxvla

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That's a cool looking speaker, but does the woofer have enough baffle? Seems like it would interfere with itself with so little baffle on the sides.
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Marvey

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I'll summon Donald to see if he can answer some questions. Woofers in open baffles are almost always EQ'd to adjust for the roll-off. Given the size (18') and excursion capabilities (max 75mm p2p) of that Aurasound monstrosity, the EQ requirements would be less extreme. The Qts .45 of that woofer (if it is the NS18-992-4A) would lend itself to an open baffle design as well. I wonder if the compensation circuits are part of that tube AXO box.
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Donald North

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On my DNA Sequence speakers, I used a custom version of the Aurasound NS15-992-4A, which has a 20Hz Fs and 0.5 Qts. Their NS18 will also work beautifully as a dipole woofer. For my speakers I intentionally made the baffle narrow to minimize baffle resonance problems and apply EQ to flatten the bass down to 30Hz.
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