Topic: The Destruction of Sincerity (Philosophy) (Read 1380 times)

TheLonePhilosopher · « **on:** December 08, 2012, 06:08:32 PM »

I'd like to toss a few ideas past you guys for thoughts. After a lot of observing, I've noticed that sincerity is often taboo. Whether it be media, discussion, politics, philosophy, there seems to be a trend where Entertainment becomes Dominant, and sincerity becomes non-existent. A few cases:

Music - The prevalence of Jazz in the 1940-1960's, Classical in the centuries before. Both sincere genres more about the artists expressing themselves, and vision. Fast forward to 2012, Gangnam Style, Justin Bieber, Carly Rae Jepsen, Katy Perry are the most viewed artists. Music completely devoid of sincerity, and dare I say soul. Music designed for one purpose, to get as many views as possible so advertisers can expose their products to the highest amount of people possible.

Movies - From Citizen Kain to the Twilight Zone, there was sincerity about in the 1940's+ Citizen Kain, a serious character study. The twilight zone, a direct show with a point in every episode. Fast forward to 2012 we get Big Bang Theory, American Idol, and Modern Family as the largest grossing TV shows. If there is sincerity to be had in any of these, we are made sure to be fed it in tiny bite size pieces.

Character/Politics and News - I may have to go back further than the 1900's for this one. Ancient Greece was quiet an open society, discussion was encouraged, and even idolized by children. People would gather to hear Socrates and Hippias discuss, for the pure intellectual pursuit. There was sincerity in these discussions, a curiosity and will to strive to learn more. News in the 1900's had a lot of emphasis on Journalistic Integrity, there was a constant battle between the Company's making money, and the Journalist not willing to compromise his integrity for the sake of Entertainment or Alarmism. Fast forward again to 2012, the Major news stations should more be considered entertainment than news, the picking of journalists with large amounts of integrity are very slim, and the sincerity is either all but gone, or glamorized and prettied up so the populace can get behind it.

Now don't get me wrong, sincerity still exists every now and then, I'm not saying it doesn't, but it seems like it's role in society has diminished and entertainment and instant gratification have taken it's place.

I have plenty more but I don't want to ramble. I'd like to hear thoughts and criticisms about this topic as it interests me greatly. Possibilities of why this trend started, if you even agree with the proposition that it is a problem, etc. All views are welcome.

Deep Funk · « **Reply #1 on:** December 12, 2012, 09:41:33 PM »

Being/acting in a sincere manner often means to consider how to formulate and pronounce what one wants to communicate to someone else or a group for that manner.

The difficulty with sincerity is how far can you go? I'm Dutch and us Dutchies can be very direct and rude without being personal because that's how we behave. Besides that I have an Asian side to my family which appreciates manners up to the extent that certain individuals can decide to shun certain people based on certain behaviour in a particular situation.

Growing up in between cultures made me aware that sincerity depends on adaptability and understanding of each others cultures and personalities. Imagine having a core message balancing on a scale with weights. Each side of the scale consists of opposites: direct approach - indirect approach, informal language - formal language, speaking loud - speaking softly, fast speech - slow speech etcetera... Variables everywhere!

If you don't know how to put it: stay polite, try to sound calm and composed and keep the message short. Sometimes I feel like cursing, kicking up mayhem and destroying whatever annoys me but when necessary I do what I summarized in the first sentence of this paragraph formulating the essential message I want to communicate.

However you judge sincerity depends on how you've learned and understood what honest sincerity means in life. At least that's what I personally think...

catscratch · « **Reply #2 on:** December 12, 2012, 11:50:33 PM »

Well... we tend to look on the past with rose-tinted glasses. I don't believe for a second that the 40s weren't as inundated with the utterly inane, music-wise, as we are today, we just don't remember any of it, and we're probably all better off for it. 60 years from now, we probably won't remember Gangam Style, but we're more likely to remember some relatively obscure artist that launched a movement in a direction which we aren't anticipating. Something a modern-day Ramones.

So at least THAT particular example I don't think stands up.

We live not so much in a culture of insincerity as a culture of liability. You simply can't go out there and run your mouth; liability has been monetized and institutionalized so you need to cover your ass.

Personally, I'm either socially immature or have a pretty severe example of Clarkson syndrome - there's a direct connection between brain and mouth with little adjudication in between. Yes, it has led to a lot of social embarrassment and alienated friends. I guess I've always lagged behind my age socially and emotionally, but that's another story. Yes, mentally too, hurr...

But I did discover something that comes with a bad reputation: stereotyping is freedom.

A little Orwellian perhaps, but think on it: being stereotyped gives you freedom to act within that stereotype with less consequence. It's what people expect. Why is it that Clarkson can get away with saying what he does (ok, it's the BBC's money and lawyers but quiet, I'm making a point), why was Hunter S. Thompson able to make open drug references with little consequence? Because they're Clarkson and Thompson. It's what people expect them to do. It's the unexpected that always shocks and produces the biggest scandal.

Which kinda means that if you have a reputation for idiotic sincerity, after the initial period of social disgrace you'll get away with it a lot more, because it's what people expect.

Anaxilus. · « **Reply #3 on:** December 13, 2012, 06:39:29 AM »

I'm going to have to blow out the sincerity claim attributed to a historical reflection.

1-Mozart composed works to make money and gain attention. Not every work was duly inspired and the Classical and Baroque period had its share of sell outs. I take a slight offense to Katy Perry btw, hehe.

2-Did you see the other crap Welles did to fulfill his contracted obligation? Watch the current movie 'Hitchcock' and see how old Hollywood is the same as the new Hollywood. Nobody remembers all the crap movies from back then since noone cared to.

3-Character and Politics in the Socratic age? You do realize how Socrates died right? Read the Gorgias too.

Sorry but the new world is the same as the old world just with different fashion and technology. The Joker was right, when the time comes, your neighbor will eat you and your children. It doesn't really matter if you or most agree with that, it matters that someone agrees with it and will act accordingly. There is no known solution to the tragedy of the commons even at a basic biological level. You want universal character? Then find a way to universally remove scarcity, pathology, insecurity, etc, etc.

rhythmdevils · « **Reply #4 on:** December 13, 2012, 07:10:23 AM »

I tend towards romanticism myself, and find it difficult not to romanticize certain times. And I think there is truth to some of it. I do think the US has had times when we were more...innocent in a way. But anytime you start romanticizing a certain time, there are other aspects that you're probably not thinking about because history can be kind of selective. You may think the 50's was a glorious time in America, but only for a very select few. What if you were black? Not so great. The 60's is often romanticized but if you lived then you might wind up finding that a lot of the people into the hippie movement were pretty superficial about it even if they were saying things you now agree with. And if you lived then you might have wound up being completely out of touch with that movement. You could be born on a farm in Arkansas and never leave.

Just some thoughts. Like I said, I often have the same thoughts as you do. I love movies like the new version of Pride and Prejudice because of the gorgeous cinematography and romanticism. I just want to live in that movie.

I disagree with you about movies and TV for sure though. I think you're cherry picking and ignoring others. There were tons of idiotic TV shows. I love Lucy? And that was one of the better ones. They may have been more innocent but not more sincere. Same goes for movies. I actually think were are living in an incredible time for cinema. There are incredible movies made every year, esp honest movies. Check out a movie called Chop Shop and another movie called Tulpan. I actually think movies like those are much more sincere than anything I've seen from the 50's or 40's. Though sincerity is hard to judge when the work is dated and you arne't really relating to the artistic choices the way people did then.

How about some movies about love. Films like Blue Valentine strike me as very sincere- a raw and realistic take on a relationship. Even 500 Days of Summer.

ultrabike · « **Reply #5 on:** December 14, 2012, 01:26:05 AM »

I think that the grass is always greener on the other side of the fence, and the past is on the other side of the fence.

rhythmdevils · « **Reply #6 on:** December 14, 2012, 01:50:47 AM »

Well sometimes the grass really is greener right?. I mean it would be awesome to see Jazz in the 50's/60's.

ultrabike · « **Reply #7 on:** December 14, 2012, 02:08:40 AM »

I think Jazz is great. I just feel that every time period in the past had it's great and not-so-great moments. I feel the same way about the present.

rhythmdevils · « **Reply #8 on:** December 14, 2012, 02:11:48 AM »

Yeah, it's never that simple.

Deep Funk · « **Reply #9 on:** January 12, 2013, 10:41:46 PM »

What if this thread would be called "The Lack Of Sincerity"?

There's no actual measure for sincerity in general. What's generally perceived as 'sincere' really is in the eyes of the beholder, the thoughts of the brain in the actual person.

If this comes across as slightly vague my apologies. I'm in a state of bliss discovering the Swans...

Author Topic: The Destruction of Sincerity (Philosophy) (Read 1380 times)

TheLonePhilosopher

The Destruction of Sincerity (Philosophy)

Deep Funk

Re: The Destruction of Sincerity (Philosophy)

catscratch

Re: The Destruction of Sincerity (Philosophy)

Anaxilus.

Re: The Destruction of Sincerity (Philosophy)

rhythmdevils

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ultrabike

Re: The Destruction of Sincerity (Philosophy)

rhythmdevils

Re: The Destruction of Sincerity (Philosophy)

ultrabike

Re: The Destruction of Sincerity (Philosophy)

rhythmdevils

Re: The Destruction of Sincerity (Philosophy)

Deep Funk

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Author Topic: The Destruction of Sincerity (Philosophy) (Read 1380 times)