CHANGSTAR: Audiophile Headphone Reviews and Early 90s Style BBS

  • December 31, 2015, 11:06:58 AM
  • Welcome, Guest
Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Advanced search  
Pages: 1 2 3 [4] 5

Author Topic: Micro-details... HD-650 vs LCD-3  (Read 4050 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Hammy

  • Able Bodied Sailor
  • Powder Monkey
  • ***
  • Brownie Points: +14/-1
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 59
Re: Micro-details... HD-650 vs LCD-3
« Reply #30 on: May 20, 2015, 06:10:53 AM »

I just wish there were an easy way to figure out what grade one's LCD2.2 is. Mine is the only one I've heard, and I live far away from meets. I've always thought it's excellent and that it's kept pace with the other headphones I've tried. Perhaps I'll really pit my new HD650 against this bitch and see how it fares.

Wondering whether your LCD2.2 is good or bad will lead to Audiophilia Nervosa.  And that's not a healthy condition.

I don't worry about it too much.  It's good to me and I'm currently satisfied with it.  I trust my ears to know that it doesn't completely suck.  If someone has a better LCD2r2 than mine that doesn't make mine worse.  One way that I judge the value of gear to me is on my personal goosebump scale.  Music played using certain gear is able to give me goosebumps as I listen.  Better gear on that scale gives me more goosebumps.  That measure has lead me well as I've tried to find gear.  It hasn't lead me astray yet.  My LCD2r2 rates highly on my goosebump scale.  To me it's a good headphone.  I know and recognize its faults.  Its faults do frustrate me at times.  But it gives me goosebumps and good listening enjoyment.  And that's good value to me.  I'm on the lookout for a headphone that is technically better but that headphone also needs to rate very highly on my goosebump scale.  It's not easy to find a headphone like that.
Logged

Schopenhauer

  • Big Boobs Big Grin
  • Able Bodied Sailor
  • Pirate
  • ***
  • Brownie Points: +20/-3
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 142
  • Schopenmeower
Re: Micro-details... HD-650 vs LCD-3
« Reply #31 on: May 20, 2015, 07:58:17 PM »

Wondering whether your LCD2.2 is good or bad will lead to Audiophilia Nervosa.  And that's not a healthy condition.

I don't worry about it too much.  It's good to me and I'm currently satisfied with it.  I trust my ears to know that it doesn't completely suck.  If someone has a better LCD2r2 than mine that doesn't make mine worse.  One way that I judge the value of gear to me is on my personal goosebump scale.  Music played using certain gear is able to give me goosebumps as I listen.  Better gear on that scale gives me more goosebumps.  That measure has lead me well as I've tried to find gear.  It hasn't lead me astray yet.  My LCD2r2 rates highly on my goosebump scale.  To me it's a good headphone.  I know and recognize its faults.  Its faults do frustrate me at times.  But it gives me goosebumps and good listening enjoyment.  And that's good value to me.  I'm on the lookout for a headphone that is technically better but that headphone also needs to rate very highly on my goosebump scale.  It's not easy to find a headphone like that.
I think this is good advice. I have something like the goosebump scale and the LCD-2.2 has always scored very high on that. I'd call it the "fuck yeah" scale. The result of the very unscientific comparison of the LCD-2.2 with the HD650 was that the former resolves like a muhfucker, as does the latter. Both resolve more than the HE-500 I have, I think. I'd say my LCD-2.2 is roughly = to my HD650, though the HD650 might handle congested passages a bit better. I'd need to listen more to figure that out. Listened to both out of my UHA-6S MKII with GO450 as DAC. Low-gain in each case. But there are a lot of things I'm not controlling for, so my impressions are worth very little.
Logged

Anaxilus

  • Phallus Belligerantus Analmorticus
  • Pirate
  • **
  • Brownie Points: +65535/-65535
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3493
  • TRS jacks must die
    • The Claw
Re: Micro-details... HD-650 vs LCD-3
« Reply #32 on: May 20, 2015, 08:14:22 PM »

Why would you listen to the HD650 from the Leckerton on low gain? What volume do you listen at?
Logged
"If you do not change direction, you may end up where you are heading." - Lao Tzu

"The Claw is our master. The Claw chooses who will go or who will stay." - The LGM Community

"You're like a dull knife, just ain't cuttin'. Talking loud, saying nothing." - James Brown

Schopenhauer

  • Big Boobs Big Grin
  • Able Bodied Sailor
  • Pirate
  • ***
  • Brownie Points: +20/-3
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 142
  • Schopenmeower
Re: Micro-details... HD-650 vs LCD-3
« Reply #33 on: May 20, 2015, 08:38:14 PM »

Ok, this is good to know. I've wanted to ask about gain settings but was worried it was n00bish. When I'm monitoring the dB level (with just an iPhone 6, but I've no idea how precise that is - my suspicion is that it isn't exceedingly so), I usually max out in the high 80s. Sometimes I might push it into the 90s, but not for long. I was operating with the idea that you'd up the gain setting only if you ran out of gain on the low setting. Usually, I don't push the dial much past noon (if I do) on low gain with the HD650. If I engage the high gain setting, then the dial would hover around nine - sometimes past, sometimes before.
Logged

Anaxilus

  • Phallus Belligerantus Analmorticus
  • Pirate
  • **
  • Brownie Points: +65535/-65535
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3493
  • TRS jacks must die
    • The Claw
Re: Micro-details... HD-650 vs LCD-3
« Reply #34 on: May 20, 2015, 08:45:35 PM »

Use high gain on those HD650s, set them free!  ;)
Logged
"If you do not change direction, you may end up where you are heading." - Lao Tzu

"The Claw is our master. The Claw chooses who will go or who will stay." - The LGM Community

"You're like a dull knife, just ain't cuttin'. Talking loud, saying nothing." - James Brown

lm4der

  • Able Bodied Sailor
  • Pirate
  • ***
  • Brownie Points: +24/-9
  • Online Online
  • Posts: 222
Re: Micro-details... HD-650 vs LCD-3
« Reply #35 on: May 20, 2015, 09:39:22 PM »

Use high gain on those HD650s, set them free!

I'm going to go ahead and ask the n00b question:  How should one choose the gain setting on an amp for the HD650?  Is it a tradeoff between more gain is better until the volume knob is so low that channel imbalance rears its head? I have a Magni 2 (non uber, but has a gain switch)...
Logged

Anaxilus

  • Phallus Belligerantus Analmorticus
  • Pirate
  • **
  • Brownie Points: +65535/-65535
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3493
  • TRS jacks must die
    • The Claw
Re: Micro-details... HD-650 vs LCD-3
« Reply #36 on: May 20, 2015, 10:03:53 PM »

I'm going to go ahead and ask the n00b question:  How should one choose the gain setting on an amp for the HD650?  Is it a tradeoff between more gain is better until the volume knob is so low that channel imbalance rears its head? I have a Magni 2 (non uber, but has a gain switch)...

Oh god, that's a loaded question. You'll have to think about headphone specs, linear drive need, dynamic capability of the phone in question, listening preferences and capabilities, feedback usage in the amps topology, channel imbalance and Miller capacitance of the potentiometer in use versus your HRTF.

Put more simply, there are a couple ways you can look at it. Use the most gain you can unless noise, distortion, high volume and channel imbalance becomes an audible problem for you. In that case, use the least amount of gain you can without missing more lively dynamics, micro-detail, body and low end presence. Typically in more basic amps, feedback is used to lower distortion, but in a way that's actually adding one form of distortion to cancel out the other. So you could wind up with a weird conundrum where you reduce noise and measured distortion, but it doesn't sound as clear and open. How interesting is that? Yeah, trade-offs kind of suck.
« Last Edit: May 21, 2015, 03:52:19 AM by Anaxilus »
Logged
"If you do not change direction, you may end up where you are heading." - Lao Tzu

"The Claw is our master. The Claw chooses who will go or who will stay." - The LGM Community

"You're like a dull knife, just ain't cuttin'. Talking loud, saying nothing." - James Brown

atomicbob

  • Able Bodied Sailor
  • Pirate
  • ***
  • Brownie Points: +143/-0
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 143
Re: Micro-details... HD-650 vs LCD-3
« Reply #37 on: May 21, 2015, 03:21:56 AM »

I'm going to go ahead and ask the n00b question:  How should one choose the gain setting on an amp for the HD650?  Is it a tradeoff between more gain is better until the volume knob is so low that channel imbalance rears its head? I have a Magni 2 (non uber, but has a gain switch)...
not picking on you lmader, but going to poke some fun at this common question.

ok, this is the advanced pyrate method for determining optimal gain switch settings. Use at your own risk. I will not take any responsibility for misuse or abuse of this method. This method only works for male geeks. The following equipment is required:

1. Hardwood seat stool approximately 80 cm high
2. Sound Level Meter with max SPL capture mode
3. Tripod for SLM positioning
4. Darts varying in range of 14 to 32 grams
5. Dartboard
6. 8.8 Kg sledgehammer

Position the hardwood seat stool in the center of a room, maintaining a 100 cm sphere of clearance in all directions excepting the floor.

Mount the SLM on the tripod, positioning such that the SLM microphone is 100 cm from the stool, aimed at the stool, at the same height as the stool.

Set the SLM for A-weighted, Fast response, Max SPL capture mode.

The inquisitor now positions themselves such that they are on the opposite side of the stool away from the SLM. Now the inquisitor places their [redickted] on the stool and pounds it with the 8.8 Kg sledgehammer.

Note the maximum SPL captured on the SLM. This should be in the range of 100 to 120 dBA.

Multiply the SPL by the 4th root of 2 and divide that result by 5.

Using that result, pick a dart whose weight most closely matches the result. Should be in the range of 14 to 32 g. Standing at regulation distance throw the dart at the dartboard and score.

Add 19 to dartboard score and then divide by 10. Noting the knob positioning of 1 to 10 following the olde analog clock notion of 1 = 7 o'clock, 5 = 12 o'clock and 10 = 5 o'clock, adjust the gain knob to the position most closely matching the last computation.

set the amplifier gain switch to the lowest setting. Plug in headphones. Listen to programme material. If sound level is too low and the gain knob greater than 5,  adjust the gain switch to the next setting. If the sound is now too loud, adjust the gain knob downward to a comfortable setting.
« Last Edit: May 21, 2015, 02:14:28 PM by atomicbob »
Logged
auditory illumination

Schopenhauer

  • Big Boobs Big Grin
  • Able Bodied Sailor
  • Pirate
  • ***
  • Brownie Points: +20/-3
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 142
  • Schopenmeower
Re: Micro-details... HD-650 vs LCD-3
« Reply #38 on: May 21, 2015, 03:25:46 AM »

Oh god, that's a loaded question. You'll have to think about headphone specs, linear drive need, dynamic capability of the phone in question, listening preferences and capabilities, feedback usage in the amps topology, channel imbalance and Miller capacitance of the potentiometer in use versus your HRTF.

Put more simply, there are a couple ways you can look at it. Use the most gain you can unless noise, distortion, high volume and channel imbalance becomes an audible problem for you. In that case, use the least amount of gain you can without missing more lively dynamics, micro-detail, body and low end presence. Typically in more basic amps, feedback is used to lower distortion, but in way that's actually adding one form of distortion to cancel out the other. So you could wind up with a weird conundrum where you reduce noise of measured distortion, but it doesn't sound as clear and open. How interesting is that? Yeah, trade-offs kind of suck.
So I popped the high gain on and pushed it to 80+dB. Sounded authoritative. I think I haven't pushed them that hard before. Yes.
Logged

lm4der

  • Able Bodied Sailor
  • Pirate
  • ***
  • Brownie Points: +24/-9
  • Online Online
  • Posts: 222
Re: Micro-details... HD-650 vs LCD-3
« Reply #39 on: May 21, 2015, 04:22:38 PM »

Quote from: lmader
how should one choose the gain setting on an amp for the HD650?

You'll have to think about headphone specs, linear drive need, dynamic capability of the phone in question

Well I was asking specifically about the HD650 headphone...
Are there any generalizations, like, do higher impedance cans generally do better with gain, etc.  Anyway.
Logged
Pages: 1 2 3 [4] 5