CHANGSTAR: Audiophile Headphone Reviews and Early 90s Style BBS

  • December 31, 2015, 11:19:46 AM
  • Welcome, Guest
Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Advanced search  
Pages: [1] 2 3 4

Author Topic: Eddie Current Super 7 Mods  (Read 6694 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Marvey

  • The Man For His Time And Place
  • Master
  • Pirate
  • *****
  • Brownie Points: +555/-33
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 6698
  • Captain Plankton and MOT: Eddie Current
Eddie Current Super 7 Mods
« on: October 19, 2012, 01:46:21 AM »

One minor complaint I've had about the Super 7 was its somewhat "thick" bassy sound which never seemed to go away despite what tubes we roll. Also, the S7 is still not quite as "fast" sounding as some of the other EC amps. We worked on a few simple mods to improve the Super 7 with some good results. While these mods will not make the S7 into a BA, we got notably cleaner, faster, and liquid sound, depending upon which capacitors we rolled. I'll let Anax share his tales of capacitor rolling results, but I will explain what we did.
  • There is Nichicon 10uF electrolyic cap in the feedback loop (removed and pictured on the right of the board.) We identified this is the major culprit. In the picture, we removed this cap and replaced them with the big red Clarity Caps. There were some immediate improvements, but ultimately Anax found more suitable replacements. (We have since tried a few others with far superior results.)
  • We tried an experiment where we increased feedback (a 130k resistor instead of the stock 180k) so we could use a smaller (higher quality) cap, but more feedback made the sound more boring, despite better measured bandwidth and linearity.
  • The interstage cap (the already "upgraded" Solen's) were replaced with a variety better sounding boutique caps. This resulted in a less grainy sound. I don't think this change was as significant (since we are just changing one film type cap to another) as the electrolytic cap replacement in the feedback loop. Again, I'll defer to Anax.
  • Currently, I've soldered alligator clips to each of the cap positions (interstage and feedback) so Anax can roll caps and possibly electrocute himself with 250V if he is not careful.
BTW, I plan to be in the Bay Area in December. I know there are a few S7 owners up there. Maybe a mini-meet where I can bring my soldering stuff. You guys can order and supply the parts. Now let there be discussion of what caps to get and the sonic results.
« Last Edit: October 19, 2012, 01:56:04 AM by purrin »
Logged

Questhate

  • Stops to get gas, buys some stax.
  • Mate
  • Pirate
  • ****
  • Brownie Points: +83/-1
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 916
  • Banned for putting ice cubes in fine Scotch
Re: Eddie Current Super 7 Mods
« Reply #1 on: October 19, 2012, 05:37:13 AM »

Good works guys. Looking forward to hearing what you mad scientists cooked up. I haven't even gotten around to rolling tubes, and you guys are on to rolling caps.

Didn't realize you guys also had a production run S7 in the mix. Surely, it's there for SPL-matched DBT purposes :)p17
Logged

dBel84

  • Ortho Ninja
  • Mate
  • Pirate
  • ****
  • Brownie Points: +86/-1
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 341
Re: Eddie Current Super 7 Mods
« Reply #2 on: October 19, 2012, 02:08:54 PM »

Got to finally hear this amp at canjam and I can only imagine what the mods do - the beauty of this amp is in the soundstaging and microdynamics , this can only get better with better cap selection.

Have you tried some of those russian PIO's? they were really good value for money but I have not seen them ( not looked for them ) recently.

..dB
 
Logged

Anaxilus.

  • Dikus Beligerantis Analmorticus
  • Pirate
  • **
  • Brownie Points: +65535/-65535
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 577
Re: Eddie Current Super 7 Mods
« Reply #3 on: October 19, 2012, 04:09:25 PM »

Got to finally hear this amp at canjam and I can only imagine what the mods do - the beauty of this amp is in the soundstaging and microdynamics , this can only get better with better cap selection.

Have you tried some of those russian PIO's? they were really good value for money but I have not seen them ( not looked for them ) recently.

..dB

I have not, I've pretty much run out of reasonably priced options (especially at 10uF) to explore that are still available on the market. 

Btw, who's Super 7 was it?  Was it Jaben?
Logged
If you do not change direction, you may end up where you are heading - Lao Tzu

dBel84

  • Ortho Ninja
  • Mate
  • Pirate
  • ****
  • Brownie Points: +86/-1
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 341
Re: Eddie Current Super 7 Mods
« Reply #4 on: October 19, 2012, 11:21:01 PM »

Yes it was Wilson's and his stock HD800 ..dB
Logged

CEE TEE

  • Master controller of all scores
  • Mate
  • Pirate
  • ****
  • Brownie Points: +98/-338
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 839
  • Need More Time To Loaf Around
Re: Eddie Current Super 7 Mods
« Reply #5 on: October 20, 2012, 12:11:35 AM »

Hey Anax...would love to hear your run-down on the differences between caps. 
 
Dunno if I "need" to lower the bass amount or change the quality as much as I am very interested in smoothing out some grain on upper mids/treble.
 
(I realize that I am trying to use the amp to fix badly produced vocals.)
Logged
sound soft harmonics rich bile rich rhyme

Marvey

  • The Man For His Time And Place
  • Master
  • Pirate
  • *****
  • Brownie Points: +555/-33
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 6698
  • Captain Plankton and MOT: Eddie Current
Re: Eddie Current Super 7 Mods
« Reply #6 on: October 20, 2012, 04:32:07 PM »

There are two caps to replace:
  • 0.1uF interstage. Jantzens work well here and the slight amount of graininess. Smoother and more resolving. It will be very tight fit with some unique mounting required.
  • 10uF feedback. This is the tricky one. 10uF film caps are big. My concern is that if the caps are too big, they will not fit on the board, and dangling wires will be necessary to reach the caps which will rest on the bottom on the chassis. I don't like the idea of long extended feedback loops. Introduces too much possibility of noise pickup or even instability / oscillation.
I believe these are the candidates which passed the test. I know Anax tried quite a few caps and various values.

Interstage cap candidates 0.1uF:
  • Jantzen Superior
  • Jantzen Silver
  • Obligato Film Oil (black)
  • Obligato Premium
  • Stock Solens-more resolving than Obligato Black but more grainy w/ a treble bite and glare
Feedback cap candidates 10uF:
  • Jantzen Silver-1; super resolving, great extension both ways, accentuates vocal grain if its there.
  • Jantzen Superior-2; less hyper resolving, same extension, fixes vocal grain used w/ the .1 Silver.
  • Obligato Premium-3; less resolving than above, more than below, upper mid glare bad for HD800 (not others) but super smooth/grain free, almost plastic sounding though. When used in both spots, think overly liquid/fake a la Shure 530.
  • Obligato Film Oil (black)-4; Very musical/analogish, good for phones that are too analytical and less resolving.  Too much syrup and colored but not overly lebenesque, acceptable if its your thing.
  • Stock Nichicons-low resolution, overly boomy, lots of grain.
I don't masturbate too much to cap rolling these days. (I find over obsessive tweaking of caps, tubes, etc. diminishes ones ability to enjoy music.) The Obligato Black 10uF at the feedback position it the only thing I would personally do because it results in the most back for buck. Getting rid of any electrolytic in the signal path will result in the biggest gains.

BTW I did not like the Jantzen Silver / Obligato Premium combo. It was too much for me, especially with the HD800s. I preferred the smoother sounding Jantzen Silver / Obligato Black combo. I have not listened to all combinations (nor do I really want to.) Maybe Anax can bring his rig with the alligator clips and you guys can decide.
« Last Edit: October 20, 2012, 05:14:00 PM by Analixus »
Logged

Anaxilus.

  • Dikus Beligerantis Analmorticus
  • Pirate
  • **
  • Brownie Points: +65535/-65535
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 577
Re: Eddie Current Super 7 Mods
« Reply #7 on: October 20, 2012, 04:54:13 PM »

I updated the list above w/ the preferred combos bolded.  They are ranked in order of transparency to 'muscality', if you get my drift. 

Think of the .1uF as you would the driver tube, the 10uF then fine tuning the signature as a gross oversimplification.

As yes, I could bring mine up.  I was thinking we could even do the clip thing for them and they could just pick/roll. Up to them.
« Last Edit: October 20, 2012, 05:12:46 PM by Analixus »
Logged
If you do not change direction, you may end up where you are heading - Lao Tzu

Marvey

  • The Man For His Time And Place
  • Master
  • Pirate
  • *****
  • Brownie Points: +555/-33
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 6698
  • Captain Plankton and MOT: Eddie Current
Re: Eddie Current Super 7 Mods
« Reply #8 on: October 20, 2012, 05:05:05 PM »

Sounds like I could live with the Jantzen Superior /  Jantzen Superior combination.
Logged

Anaxilus.

  • Dikus Beligerantis Analmorticus
  • Pirate
  • **
  • Brownie Points: +65535/-65535
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 577
Re: Eddie Current Super 7 Mods
« Reply #9 on: October 20, 2012, 05:08:10 PM »

Sounds like I could live with the Jantzen Superior /  Jantzen Superior combination.

I think you could do the silver/superior fine (resolving, yet smooth musical enough where it's needed; I listened to this combo for > 8 hours one day and went to sleep w/ it).  Especially w/ the right HD800 or HP1000.  A superior/silver would be a different matter and probably more the signature you fear (less resolving, more bite and grain w/ this combo). 

Remember too, I have the mk1 PWD.  You're better off w/ the mk2.
« Last Edit: October 20, 2012, 05:19:24 PM by Analixus »
Logged
If you do not change direction, you may end up where you are heading - Lao Tzu
Pages: [1] 2 3 4