CHANGSTAR: Audiophile Headphone Reviews and Early 90s Style BBS
Non-Audio Stuff => Random Thoughts => Topic started by: zerodeefex on August 18, 2015, 05:53:00 PM
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Poll time :boom:
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Can someone write up what he did? For the sake of the poll?
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Wow, we're back in 7th grade, huh?
How many of you guys have spent time with the guy?
Face to face, sit down over a beer and talk?
He's a nice guy and very helpful/supportive in my experience.
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To be fair, I don't think it was really Dan's fault, but rather one of his employees who posted them. And yes, it was a stupid thing to do, but he apparently didn't do it intentionally to steal their thunder and was quite apologetic and shameful about the mishap.
Unless there has been other recent incidents of actual douchebaggery committed by Dan that I'm not aware of?
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Wow, we're back in 7th grade, huh?
Well, Ravi did start the thread so....;)
How many of you guys have spent time with the guy?
Face to face, sit down over a beer and talk?
Just curious though. How many people have done those things with someone only to be screwed over, taken advantage of or punked by that same person? Just thought I'd put that out in a very generic way.
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You should ask some other guys in the business how Dan has treated them or what he may have said to/about them. :) (Good, neutral, or negative...not trying to imply one way or the other.)
From a customer standpoint, though, very nice guy and helpful. I have only had positive experiences with him myself in that regard. He was nice to me over the phone as well for an issue I had with my Alpha Dog.
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Can someone write up what he did? For the sake of the poll?
In summary, blowing schiit's product announcement and co-opting the schiit show with his own new product release, as discussed here: http://www.changstar.com/index.php/topic,2703.msg77876.html#msg77876
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hello,
then there's this:
http://www.changstar.com/index.php/topic,2105.0.html
and i remember a shoutbox post that indicated Dan refused to provide a "corrected" pair of AD's for this tour.
i have no respect for his business practices and his lack of transparency.
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I've met him a few times and he always seemed like a perfectly nice guy.
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I've met him a few times and he always seemed like a perfectly nice guy.
I've met him a few times too and it ranged from him being sugary sweet to him whining about how he should have won a contest to guess the frequency of a singing bowl. I've also seem him act like an awkward dick to Luis.
I am not judging him on his words, I'm judging him on his actions. Between the bullshit he pulled with measurements and Marv, the weird shit with Luis, and Jude is calling up people on this board and directly telling them that Dan asked to have me banned from his thread when I brought up my own Alpha Prime and it's less than stellar measurements, I'm going to go ahead and judge him as a whiney douche.
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Poll time :boom:
Really? Really?
Everyone makes mistakes.
Grow up.
EDIT: Never mind. I thought this thread was just about the Schiit Show leak.
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hello,
concerning MrSpeakers preempting the SchittShow,
this is what should have happened (forgive the poetic license):
"MrSpeakers internal email, private and confidential
From: Dan
To: All
Subject: The upcoming SchittShow
We have been invited to participate in a public event with a senior partner who will be reveling new products.
Our partner has imposed a press embargo to increased anticipation and excitement for their new gear.
As we will also be introducing a new product at this event. it is imperative that we respect this press embargo.
Any employee who leaks, publishes or spreads rumors concerning ANY new products (either our own or our partner's) will be subject to adverse action up to and including termination.
Let's all work together to keep this a surprise for our and our partner's customers."
alas, this didn't happen, and apparently Dan has complete deniability.
if i were a MOT, i would not partner with this company.
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Not a douche...
It was a simple goof up, maybe a lack of communication.
I like Dan. When I met him last year, he didn't laugh at me at all when I put his Alpha Primes on backwards
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Does my data point become confounded if I voted for amuse-douche simply because I read it as an option and laughed out loud?
I think that is where he falls anyway, more or less. Based on my interactions with him, I would put him under the "good guy, but..." category. And yet, there are a few too many
but's.
Also,
LOL BUT'S
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Dammit. I have a headache.
(http://www.meriahnichols.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/05/picard-ears.jpg)
Staying out of this one. Far away.
So much for a kinder and gentler Changstar. We'll wait until the reboot.
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Not a douche...
It was a simple goof up, maybe a lack of communication.
I like Dan. When I met him last year, he didn't laugh at me at all when I put his Alpha Primes on backwards
Maybe cuz they sound better that way?
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Dammit. I have a headache.
(http://www.meriahnichols.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/05/picard-ears.jpg)
That's the same look my music teacher used to get when I was 10. My music turned him into a newt. He got better. :P
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I think his latest headphone, the Ether is vastly overpriced. But I think he's the nicest guy and always friendly at meets.
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https://www.reddit.com/r/headphones/comments/3hi2k6/psa_mrspeakers_ama_at_0800_pdt_august_19th/
Well you guys can go ask him about the schiit incident or the bad headphones.
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That's the same look my music teacher used to get when I was 10. My music turned him into a newt. He got better. :P
Do you weigh the same as a Duck? Sir Galahad needs a word with you...
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I think his latest headphone, the Ether is vastly overpriced. But I think he's the nicest guy and always friendly at meets.
agreed, likely a bit overpriced based on sound performance alone (I wld say $1.2k is more reasonable), but honestly what headphones arent overpriced nowadays? At least less overpriced compared to Audezes.
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agreed, likely a bit overpriced based on sound performance alone (I wld say $1.2k is more reasonable), but honestly what headphones arent overpriced nowadays? At least less overpriced compared to Audezes.
Begs another poll doesn't it?
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honestly what headphones arent overpriced nowadays?
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Begs another poll doesn't it?
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HD600/HD650?
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HD600/HD650?
These are the current prices in Switzerland (in CHF, which is almost 1-1 to USD):
Sennheiser HD 600: 249 CHF
Beyerdynamic DT 880: 159 CHF
Focal Spirit Professional: 242 CHF
AKG K 701: 212 CHF
Philips Fidelio L2: 299 CHF
These are pretty much the only ones I can think of right now that arent overpriced but damn good value (with the exception of the K 701 imho which is outclassed by both the DT 880 and the HD 600).
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I haven't heard it yet, but I thought Zach's pricing on the Omni seemed reasonable - at least by today's standards. It was refreshing to see a flagship that didn't launch at $1000+.
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I haven't heard it yet, but I thought Zach's pricing on the Omni seemed reasonable - at least by today's standards. It was refreshing to see a flagship that didn't launch at $1000+.
What about Omni >> Ether >>> Alpha Dog Prime?
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There's a serious lack of omni impressions around here :o
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There's a serious lack of omni impressions around here :o
No kidding. I hadn't even heard of it until this post.
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Guess we'll have to wait and see how the final Omni turns out!
Zach knows I'd have a stern talking to him if his prices started to get too high. :)
Edit: Typed this, and then those two posts. Zach's still working on the Omni. From what I've heard myself, though, powerful bass, good midrange, treble more easy-going and smooth than Blackwood, and a surprisingly spacious sound. Again, final tuning TBD. Should be within the next few weeks, AFAIK.
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Mr. Speakers AMA: https://www.reddit.com/r/headphones/comments/3hlc1c/i_am_dan_clark_aka_mrspeakers_askmeanything/
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There's a serious lack of omni impressions around here :o
I should get the Cherry and Blackwood Omni loaners sometime soon. I'll post impressions on Changstar.
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What about Omni >> Ether >>> Alpha Dog Prime?
That gets me excited. Although I haven't heard the Ether or the Prime. I've heard only the Mad Dog and Alpha Dog.
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That gets me excited. Although I haven't heard the Ether or the Prime. I've heard only the Mad Dog and Alpha Dog.
Omni >> Ether > Mad Dog Pro ~>= Alpha Dog ~>= Mad Dog > Alpha Dog Prime
Very much generalities. What I like about the Omni is its openness and coherent sound throughout. Early Omni tuning had a bright spot. I know Hans will get Zach to fix that because anything 0.5db over flat in the upper mids and treble will cause Hans immense pain; and I also trust Zach's ears. I believe OJ is a big fan of them as well.
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Omni >> Ether > Mad Dog Pro ~>= Alpha Dog ~>= Mad Dog > Alpha Dog Prime
Very much generalities. What I like about the Omni is its openness and coherent sound throughout. Early Omni tuning had a bright spot. I know Hans will get Zach to fix that because anything 0.5db over flat in the upper mids and treble will cause Hans immense pain; and I also trust Zach's ears. I believe OJ is a big fan of them as well.
Latest iteration I heard at the Chicago meet seemed to have that solved. They are very, very good. Zach has done top notch work with the Omnis.
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Latest iteration I heard at the Chicago meet seemed to have that solved. They are very, very good. Zach has done top notch work with the Omnis.
I told you I trust his ears. I'm sure he doesn't want to hear Hans bitch about a 1db treble peak.
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I told you I trust his ears. I'm sure he doesn't want to hear Hans bitch about a 1db treble peak.
:)p13 :)p13 :)p13 :)p13
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LOL
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I told you I trust his ears. I'm sure he doesn't want to hear Hans bitch about a 1db treble peak.
LOL
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Omni >> Ether > Mad Dog Pro ~>= Alpha Dog ~>= Mad Dog > Alpha Dog Prime
Very much generalities. What I like about the Omni is its openness and coherent sound throughout. Early Omni tuning had a bright spot. I know Hans will get Zach to fix that because anything 0.5db over flat in the upper mids and treble will cause Hans immense pain; and I also trust Zach's ears. I believe OJ is a big fan of them as well.
Wow, the Omni wasn't even on my radar until I saw this. I've been reading about it a lot now and I'm impressed by your thoughts, especially considering they are nearly half the cost of the Ether. Guess I should keep tabs on this headphone now :)
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Keep tabs on it. Maybe we can ask Zach for a loaner.
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HD600/HD650?
ya, but that kinda proves my point doesn't it? the hd600 were initially released like what, 15+ years ago
the majority of new headphones released nowadays are pretty much going to be ranging from moderately to severely overpriced.
edit: I'm quite excited about the omnis too! looking forward to seeing impressions
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HD600/HD650?
Nope, on the Audez'e range..
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on the Audez'e range...
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...where the deer and the antelope play?
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I should get the Cherry and Blackwood Omni loaners sometime soon. I'll post impressions on Changstar.
I'm glad you're on the tour too. Please start a thread for your impressions. I'm on it too, but I'm quite a few weeks later then you it seems. (14th I think)
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...where the deer and the antelope play?
Ex-hippie alright. Damn it Nick, I've been singing Home on the Range for the last 5 minutes, much to my family's consternation
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I told you I trust his ears. I'm sure he doesn't want to hear Hans bitch about a 1db treble peak.
And this is the guy that's going to Tyll's place for the Big Sound shindig. :)p8
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Keep tabs on it. Maybe we can ask Zach for a loaner.
I've already emailed Zach and there should be a pirate loaner coming our way when the Omni is at the final stage.
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Strangely I'm now reminded of Zach's nickname on here. "not Dan". popcorn
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And this is the guy that's going to Tyll's place for the Big Sound shindig. :)p8
I've actually already pre-written my experience article.
"Hedfuns nut prefetctly flut mid thru trebz, nunnuv em, deserv throwin in trashh. DACs not NOS, trash. Ambs nut derk and laid bek enough, TRASH. Got shoes wet TRASH. Enjoyd hand holding, good times. But everything is trsh."
Joke is on all of you that voted for me! :)
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Nutting in the dark while laying on your back? You like to live dangerously I see.
No, I don't see. I don't need to see that.
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I can draw you a picture per my usual art style.
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That's the face you make while "writing reviews" eh?
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Ex-hippie alright. Damn it Nick, I've been singing Home on the Range for the last 5 minutes, much to my family's consternation
We are meeting at the weekend: you can get your own back by singing it to me! Should I bring ear plugs?
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bump
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bump
LOL, mind elaborating why you think this thread particularly needs to be bumped ?
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Actually, I was about to and I suspect Stabone read my mind. After reading the Ether C review and the threads on HF for his recent releases, I have to wonder about the business dealings between Dan and Jude. I always am curious about "nature of the business" type transactions.
It's super odd to me that the Ether and Ether C are being positioned as great for the price. $1500 goddam dollars and my $300 HD600 on the Rag/Yggy combo edged out the $1500 Ether on Dr Findley's Yggy/Rag combo in technicalities AND enjoyment.
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I thought the douchbaggery poll was mostly about the Schiitshow, but if you want to include the overpricing of hps, fine by me. However I'd suggest you had Dr. Bian and virtually any maker that's pimped on HF in the poll.
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It does seem that Mr.Speakers does get extra preferential treatment compared to the other sponsors. A dedicated review of the Ether-Carbon, a video almost totally dedicated to the Alpha Dog, solid mentions of the Ether in other videos, lots of front page mentions (in fact two simultaneously right now). I can't think of any other MoT who has received such a huge amount of favorable treatment and exposure.
Also for a time when Luis (a "competitor" to Mr.Speakers) was more active, posts on the most inane things regarding his Paradox line of products would magically disappear because of complaints flagged by "mysterious" persons.
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It does seem that Mr.Speakers does get extra preferential treatment compared to the other sponsors. A dedicated review of the Ether-Carbon, a video almost totally dedicated to the Alpha Dog, solid mentions of the Ether in other videos, lots of front page mentions (in fact two simultaneously right now). I can't think of any other MoT who has received such a huge amount of favorable treatment and exposure.
Also for a time when Luis (a "competitor" to Mr.Speakers) was more active, posts on the most inane things regarding his Paradox line of products would magically disappear because of complaints flagged by "mysterious" persons.
Can't say I'm going much on hf anymore, let alone to look at the reviews and frontpage. But the HEK got his share isn't it ?
Anyway, carry on. Seems like there's some more to say.
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HEK/EF6 got its share. So did Rag/Yggy. So did Shure 1440/1840. The list goes on. But if you want to discuss little points, I don't remember Jude ever doing a HFM triple-jizz-bang bonanza with the top three HFM headphones: HEK, HE-560, and HE-6 within the span of less than a year... or even a Schiit triple-jizz. (I might be guilty of a Schiit quad-jizz, but hey shoot me - not my fault Schiit released a ton of crap last year at prices were I could afford to BUY all of them themself, or BUY them and put them on the CS loaner program or share.)
Finally, I don't have a problem with advertising, and I'm certainly not going to go all Arthur Salvatore over it, but certain things do appear kind of icky. At least Stereophile has some level of independence, albeit a "Chinese wall". Stereophile also has JA who measures shit, is knowledgeable about measurements, and calls a spade a spade. The two or three measurements Jude has done with his version of C.U.N.T. (G.R.A.S.S. or whatever) seem selective, and even then, he's not technical - he's an idiot when it comes to understanding or interpreting stuff like this.
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BTW, just noticed the $200-$250 DUM cable! :)p13
I also get the feeling that Head-Fi gives a lot of front page coverage to MrSpeakers. Consider that there are perhaps a bit more HiFiMan products with perhaps quite a bit more threads over there relative to MrSpeakers offerings.
Then again, it's Jude's forum. He certainly can go bananas over MrSpeakers if he wants to.
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HEK/EF6 got its share. So did Rag/Yggy. So did Shure 1440/1840. The list goes on. But if you want to discuss little points, I don't remember Jude ever doing a HFM triple-jizz-bang bonanza with the top three HFM headphones: HEK, HE-560, and HE-6 within the span of less than a year... or even a Schiit triple-jizz. (I might be guilty of a Schiit quad-jizz, but hey shoot me - not my fault Schiit released a ton of crap last year at prices were I could afford to BUY all of them themself, or BUY them and put them on the CS loaner program or share.)
Finally, I don't have a problem with advertising, and I'm certainly not going to go all Arthur Salvatore over it, but certain things do appear kind of icky. At least Stereophile there's some level of independence, a "Chinese wall" at least. Stereophile also has JA who measures shit, is knowledgeable about measurements, and calls a spade a spade. The two or three measurements Jude has done with his version of C.U.N.T. (G.R.A.S.S. or whatever) seem selective, and even then, he's not technical - he's an idiot when it comes to understanding or interpreting stuff like this.
Fang doesn't pay Jude nearly enough for him to police over every small post on Head-Fi or advertise his products.
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HEK/EF6 got its share. So did Rag/Yggy. So did Shure 1440/1840. The list goes on. But if you want to discuss little points, I don't remember Jude ever doing a HFM triple-jizz-bang bonanza with the top three HFM headphones: HEK, HE-560, and HE-6 within the span of less than a year... or even a Schiit triple-jizz. (I might be guilty of a Schiit quad-jizz, but hey shoot me - not my fault Schiit released a ton of crap last year at prices were I could afford to BUY all of them themself, or BUY them and put them on the CS loaner program or share.)
Finally, I don't have a problem with advertising, and I'm certainly not going to go all Arthur Salvatore over it, but certain things do appear kind of icky. At least Stereophile has some level of independence, albeit a "Chinese wall". Stereophile also has JA who measures shit, is knowledgeable about measurements, and calls a spade a spade. The two or three measurements Jude has done with his version of C.U.N.T. (G.R.A.S.S. or whatever) seem selective, and even then, he's not technical - he's an idiot when it comes to understanding or interpreting stuff like this.
Agreed. That's why I'm here.
I'd just say that Dan's getting his money's worth. Now I'm not going to the mall expecting the employees to tell me I should go to another shop. I couldn't give two shit about what's pimped on hf, but I understand some of you guys are impacted in a different way than I am.
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Fang doesn't pay Jude nearly enough for him to police over every small post on Head-Fi or advertise his products.
@Frenchbat: since you wanted to know more, and this is 70% heresay, rumor, etc. ...
More than a few rather inane posts on product information of Mr.Speakers competitors have been deleted by mysterious persons flagging them as violating "rules". Also quite a few people here who have criticized the sound quality of Mr.Speakers products have been banned from his product threads.
Again, it would appear that Mr.Speakers receives very favorable treatment on HF. I don't see this favoritism this extending to HFM, Sennheiser, etc. There have been lots of criticisms on HEK, HE560, HD700 threads over there. Then again, it's likely the folks at HFM, Sennheiser, or others just don't care enough to press the red-flag button, or call the Jude hotline.
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Could be he pays a protection fee, like shop owners do to local mafia. If you don't pay it then your windows don't get broken in.
Thing with HFM, I think the boss doesnt visit the head-fi shop that often to care if windows get broken, whereas Dan probably want to keep his windows in top condition.
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@Frenchbat: since you wanted to know more, and this is 100% heresay ... more than a few rather inane posts on product information of Mr.Speakers competitors have been deleted by mysterious persons flagging them as violating "rules".
If Dan is found directly or indirectly, fully or partially responsible for this, I expect a "leasson's learned", "sorry, we didn't know what we were doing", "we screwed up, but now we know better", "come to our office, will bring gurls and booze. See how cool we are. Repeat after me. Mr. Speakers. Is. Cool. Repeat Again.", speak or something like that.
It is what it is. Maybe Dan means it. Maybe be not. Who cares. I mean, front page or not, I may be wrong, but I don't think MrSpeakers threads are getting that much activity. He needs to pay Jude more. And Jude needs to have a MrSpeakers Day every week where all of the Front Page is all about MrSpeakers.
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Not denying the favoritism Marv'. Just saying that I do think as Knerian, that Dan's getting his money's worth. Maybe it's paid, maybe it's whining to Jude, or sexual favor, dunno, don't wanna. I've heard other things, not specific to MrSpeakers. Could be HFM, Senn, etc are just smarter in their strategy, and it's not as visible.
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Jude flat out told a pirate on the phone that Dan was the one who directly complained about me to Jude (despite having bought them new) in the Alpha Prime thread. Many of my posts were deleted and I was banned from the thread.
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Not denying the favoritism Marv'. Just saying that I do think as Knerian, that Dan's getting his money's worth. Maybe it's paid, maybe it's whining to Jude, or sexual favor, dunno, don't wanna. I've heard other things, not specific to MrSpeakers. Could be HFM, Senn, etc are just smarter in their strategy, and it's not as visible.
I agree with your "the smarter in their strategy" assesment. IMO and from the little I've seen in the past, Dan can get very emotional and perhaps even irrational when he feels his business threatened. That is not very smart nor healty if you ask me.
At some point one just needs to live life and sip some margaritas and don't give two shits. You do the best you can and fuck it. Dan seems to go bananas however and seems to start doing some pretty questionable stuff. Say, I measured his cans, they do alright... not enough. Dan expected uber-awesome. So measurements are shit. That's from my humble, not giving a shit side. Other guys I trust however, seemed to have experiensed the full power of Dan's force lightning.
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Jude flat out told a pirate on the phone that Dan was the one who directly complained about me to Jude (despite having bought them new) in the Alpha Prime thread. Many of my posts were deleted and I was banned from the thread.
If I remember correctly, none of your posts were rude, angry, or dishonest. You even directly admitted that the mystery pair sent to me - you purchased yourself - and also the reasons for doing so: inconsistency from not one, but two other units (and the fact that I heard one other at CanJam, which did sound good)
FWIW, I find this paragraph rather cute from Jude, obviously a reply to your questions regarding product consistency (which have probably been deleted):
NOTE: MrSpeakers shared overlaid measurements with me of a five-unit pull, and the consistency was excellent. I’m confident what I’m hearing is what will go to production. I’ll confirm this when I hear a final shipping version.
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IIRC, weren't those overlaid measurements on a large Y-axis scale to make them appear closer than they actually were? It's like people that thought the SoundMagic HP100 graph showed how super awesome neutral they were...without realizing the Y-axis CLEARLY showed a 200dB scale. (To be fair, I overlooked it too and made a huge mistake of purchasing them. Returned them right away.) Of course...Ether-C wasn't on a 200dB scale, nor were the measurements horribly off. Closely matched tuning, but with many spots showing 2dB of variance.
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Experience has taught me to not trust FR or CSD or distortion measurements offered by headphone manufacturers. This is not against Mr.Speakers or anyone else specifically. I consider any of these sort offered by a manufacturer as marketing material which needs to be verified, especially when CSD noise floors are raised super high, 1/3 octave smoothing is used, the Y axis is extended, X-axis is cropped, or distortion is measured in linear (instead of log) percentage.
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Jude pimps mrspeakers products hard - no doubt about it. I still feel pretty duped that I bought into his claims/review suggesting the original AD's were among the best closed cans ever made. I was contemplating buying a fostex mod from Luis (since I never could get the damn 1khz peak eliminated from my diymod), but I let myself get swayed. Shame on me.
I really wanted to love the AD's, but in retrospect, aside from the geek appeal of printed cups, I'm not even convinced they were an improvement on stock t50rp's. There was just no getting past the weak bass response for me or the slightly peaky trebles - especially after I stumbled on a pair of cheap used ES10's, ran some sweeps on them, and realized that the ES10's, although not without their flaws, are just way better closed headphones than AD's at a fraction of the price. Releasing the AD prime, that clearly was not well conceived or ready for market, less than a year after many of us received our original AD's, just stank of an ill advised cash grab. All in all, the fact that Jude continues to push product for this company makes me very curious as to the details of the sponsor relationship.
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I'm not sure if douchebaggery is the correct diagnosis. His business decisions and his defensiveness show a certain amount of desperation.
Releasing the defective Alpha Primes instead of waiting for the Ether was probably done to keep the cash flowing and was a disservice to his customers. I don't want to say he knew the product/manufacturing process had QC issues - but he should have.
Some people just aren't cut out to run their own business. They panic and make bad decisions that affect product quality and then get defensive or vicious when faced with the truth.
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It is very possible. And I will not say I would not do similar or much worse things if desperate. However, being desperate does not make acts of douchebaggery right.
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So is Dan going to put up a banner ad anytime soon here? Or sponsor the next Changfest?
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This thread is very sobering. No wonder I've seen such a discrepancy between the utter hype of Dan's headphones on h-f and the more reserved, sometimes critical impressions on other forums and even on reddit. I'd rather not give any of my money to people who think they can buy their favorable reviews and censor the unfavorable. I live in China - I get enough of that here already.
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In China the government thinks that rabbits can convince people to return to a disaster zone.
I understand your sentiment. Hype-Fi has been trumped.
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In China the government thinks that rabbits can convince people to return to a disaster zone.
I wish I didn't know what you were alluding to, but sadly I do. I have many friends in Beijing (not far from Tianjin) and they say that when it rains, their skin burns and their coughing is worse than usual. Yet on the news all you hear are stories about puppies saved from the blast zone. Sad...
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China, more specifically the Communist Party wants GDP: high and sustainable.
Thing is, what Europe achieved during the Industrial Revolution in about a century the Communist Party is trying to realise in a few decades. That is asking for trouble from your people, environment and the finite resources you already have.
It is a good thing some Chinese people are speaking up, among them many loyal party member and mothers.
End of derailment. China is still so fascinating in history and culture that I also want to learn more.