CHANGSTAR: Audiophile Headphone Reviews and Early 90s Style BBS
Lobby => Head Amps, DACs, Sources, Portable Equipment Discussion => Topic started by: pyfgcrl on May 05, 2015, 01:27:45 AM
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Hey everyone. So, I hear there's a new Geek Out... V2 model available. Would love to get candid detailed impressions from anyone who's had the chance to audition it and has experience comparing a number of DACs and their quality. There's a new delta-sigma chip in this DAC (the ESS SABRE ES9018AQ2M) and I'd like to know if the typical SQ flaws inherent with DACs based on other recent SABRE32 chips are still present in this product, or if it trades for a new set of problems. Thoughts from those that have had a chance to hear it first hand are really appreciated.
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Quite a few impressions have been posted in the SF Bay Area Meet Impressions (http://www.changstar.com/index.php/topic,2362.0.html) thread.
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Fantastic. Thanks so much.
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Hey everyone. So, I hear there's a new Geek Out... V2 model available. Would love to get candid detailed impressions from anyone who's had the chance to audition it and has experience comparing a number of DACs and their quality. There's a new delta-sigma chip in this DAC (the ESS SABRE ES9018AQ2M) and I'd like to know if the typical SQ flaws inherent with DACs based on other recent SABRE32 chips are still present in this product, or if it trades for a new set of problems. Thoughts from those that have had a chance to hear it first hand are really appreciated.
Hard to say where it lines up without direct comparison, but I feel confident it can compete against GOOD $500-$700 DACs. What mattered most to me is that I found it emotionally involving. Meaning good plankton, good microdynamics, good PRAT. It was not flat sounding at all. The older GOv1 always seem to have lines that shot up too straight and too fast, missing a lot of volumes in between. Sort of like an inverse compression - compressed toward the high volumes and compressed toward the low volumes. The GOv2 now fills in everything. It is the real deal. It is slightly bright and it is still a D-S DAC, but heck it's a very very good DAC.
Stay tuned... I have a unit and I need to give it a good evaluation as a DAC. My impressions were v2 powering the HE-560, which is not an easy headphone to power without it sounding limp.
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I like it better than any DAC I've owned outside of the XFi + LPS, the Transdac, and the Yggdrasil fwiw.
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So does this one hiss with IEMs?
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How was the amp section, fellas? Good enough to not need the Leck in tow?
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How was the amp section, fellas? Good enough to not need the Leck in tow?
Good enough is a loaded question. Are you asking if the amp section is as good as the Leck or good enough to maybe not miss it in a slimmed down gear profile?
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I'm fine with how the amp section handled something as tough to drive as the HE-560. For devices, like GO, I don't want to bother with extra shit. For me, it's either good sound in a super convenient package or uber sound in 100 lbs of amp, DAC and transport.
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Good enough is a loaded question. Are you asking if the amp section is as good as the Leck or good enough to maybe not miss it in a slimmed down gear profile?
The former, Anax.. I'm wondering if the balanced output can hang with the Leck.
I'm fine with how the amp section handled something as tough to drive as the HE-560. For devices, like GO, I don't want to bother with extra shit. For me, it's either good sound in a super convenient package or uber sound in 100 lbs of amp, DAC and transport.
Thanks Marv.. that's reassuring.
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I'm fine with how the amp section handled something as tough to drive as the HE-560. For devices, like GO, I don't want to bother with extra shit. For me, it's either good sound in a super convenient package or uber sound in 100 lbs of amp, DAC and transport.
Spot on. I already have a DAC/Amp with the freakin' rubber bands. Do not want to be using the GO as a DAC only.
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I care about sonics first and foremost. I don't have $1000 ciems to have 'good enough' sound. Not my thing. $250 gets me a B2+Sansa Clip+ which is 'good enough'.
Different strokes...
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I like it better than any DAC I've owned outside of the XFi + LPS, the Transdac, and the Yggdrasil fwiw.
Wow, that's saying a lot. Now, what about the integrated amp? I don't suppose you could use this along with a Liquid Carbon, huh...
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I'm fine with how the amp section handled something as tough to drive as the HE-560. For devices, like GO, I don't want to bother with extra shit. For me, it's either good sound in a super convenient package or uber sound in 100 lbs of amp, DAC and transport.
Mmm, that's a good point. I guess it defeats the purpose if it's not grab-n-go.
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So almost everyone loves the DAC of it, wouldn't be nice if they release a DAC only version?
It would be cheaper and you could use it with a smarthphone without the Y splitter for the battery, because it should need less power, and then just plug an amp.
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I like it better than any DAC I've owned outside of the XFi + LPS, the Transdac, and the Yggdrasil fwiw.
Damn your making me regret missing that transdac auction. I was just waiting to get closer to the end of the auction now I'm transdacless walk the plank2
So almost everyone loves the DAC of it, wouldn't be nice if they release a DAC only version?
It would be cheaper and you could use it with a smarthphone without the Y splitter for the battery, because it should need less power, and then just plug an amp.
Whoa let's just let them get this out last time people wanted something slightly different the wave campaign happen. Ask those people how they like it. Lhlabs is moving in the right direction let's just let it play out.
I care about sonics first and foremost. I don't have $1000 ciems to have 'good enough' sound. Not my thing. $250 gets me a B2+Sansa Clip+ which is 'good enough'.
Different strokes...
Anax what audible gains do you get from adding the lekerton to the line?
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More info on the Geek Out V2 will be released today at Noon PST. Many of you have asked and today is the day we're going to fill you in on the deets. Check out www.lhlabs.com/415 (http://www.lhlabs.com/415) at Noon today.
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Now I wish I committed when it was still batch ~5-6... Have to wait till November now facepalm
I really hope it's ready for Xmas time popcorn
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Good things going on over at the LH site. See Casey's link above.
Also, Casey, maybe you can field this question: the V2+ feature description says "With selectable gain settings of 1000mW, 450mW & 100mW, Geek Out V2+ pairs perfectly with those monstrous power hungry cans or your uber sensitive IEM’s."
When I look at the comparo chart though, it shows 450mW as for the Infinity version only and only two gain settings on the stock V2+. A clarification would be excellent!
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Good things going on over at the LH site. See Casey's link above.
Also, Casey, maybe you can field this question: the V2+ feature description says "With selectable gain settings of 1000mW, 450mW & 100mW, Geek Out V2+ pairs perfectly with those monstrous power hungry cans or your uber sensitive IEM’s."
When I look at the comparo chart though, it shows 450mW as for the Infinity version only and only two gain settings on the stock V2+. A clarification would be excellent!
The Infinity will have the 450mW option. I just used the description as a "catch all" for once the Infinity is available to be released....To answer your next question about when it will be released, it'll be relatively soon :-)
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I want an infinity! That's the SKU for me.
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I want an infinity! That's the SKU for me.
I'm going to hurt you, kid!
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I want an infinity! That's the SKU for me.
yah, would prefer that Infinity also- but not knowing the markup $ or dates of it-
I jumped at Batch5 of the V2+ today.
how I was asleep at the wheel to miss Batch 1 is work's fault.
been hoping for a battery+GeekOut product for awhile now. stoked for this!
:)p1
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The V2+ doesn't have an analog input, does it?
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Casey.. it was mentioned that those of us who backed the Geek Stream (now GO V2+ Infinity) from the IGG campaign would receive the V2+ sooner than the pre-ordered V2/V2+.. by sooner, I'm hoping within the next few weeks or so.. not late-July 2015.. correct?
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At the last SF Bay meet, I did some extensive (read: 20 minutes) comparison against Geek Out 450 with 3 different headphones: Ether, my LCD-2, and HE-1000, and here are my thoughts in closer details:
First thing that hit me was the gradation of volume shifts. This applied to everything from super low sub bass all the way to upper midrange (I have difficulties dealing with higher than upper midrange, so I can't quite say anything about up there). Subtle variations in intensity are more easily picked out with V2, whereas my 450 tends to just smooth over or ignore these variations. Like Marv said, it tends to shoot up too fast. Or... in my own words, let me describe this: it's like I'm hearing the transitions in my music... from one part to the next.
The ability to reveal those transitions makes the V2 more "coherent" to me. Granted, without hearing that in the first place, I would have thought the presentation of the 450 was good. Next to V2, 450 sounds a bit like a radio in that way... since the subtle variations are kinda inaudible, or lost. I think this is why Marv said V2 sounded more musical. I agree with him. It wasn't the extra details, but that the subtle variations in the vocal, which represent the different states of emotions for the singer, are just more audible, lending to that musicality. This applies to instruments as well. The tone of strings are more varied, more shaded, and more... emotional, rather than just monotonic plucking.
Is this related to high resolution? Uh... not really. I noticed this even with 256kbps AAC music at 44.1KHz 16-bit. It's definitely not a resolution problem. In fact, it's the same thing with Yggy. It's not resolution. It's simply how the DAC is... planktons have always been there. Ya just need a DAC that can pull 'em out. And I'm quite certain V2 is more capable than 450 at that.
As a whole, I think V2's tonality is more agreeable than 450 as well. At least it is to my ears. It's a bit less bright, more bassy, but bass is very tight, focused, and articulate, and midrange is a bit more even. I think what it is is probably the absence of some upper midrange/lower treble peakiness. I never thought that the 450 had that, but then I heard V2, and now I can hear it plain as day. It's like a slight metallic/sharp tinge to the treble range for me. It gives strings some good definition, but I don't think it's realistic, as all strings sound a bit too sharp, whereas I'm sure different string instruments with different string materials should sound different.
So that's how I hear the V2... as an overall improvement over V1 (450 in this case). As for how it compares to the other DACs, well, I'm ill-equipped right now, so I can't quite tell, but I'm sure it'll be very competitive with DACs around its price range.
Bill is not a resolution and detail whore, but this DAC is slowly convincing me that I'll want those at some point. :)p1
Casey, I didn't write this in my email response to ya (since you asked for my impressions). I hope this is detailed enough? Many at the meet who got to try my system with either of the 3 headphones above also shared the same sentiment, that...the biggest difference between the 2 was the transitions in between... well, everything. It was quite an eye-opening experience!
Pyrates, if there is ever a DAC that Bill the tonal and midrange guy recommends, this is it! :)p2
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Your impressions were as a DAC or DAC/Amp?
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The V2+ doesn't have an analog input, does it?
Nope. You can't use it as an amp-only.
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Your impressions were as a DAC or DAC/Amp?
As a DAC. I didn't get to try it as a DAC/amp with any of those 3 headphones, so I'm not sure how it'll do there, but brief trial with the DT770 was quite nice. I'm sure I can go with it as a DAC/amp with the 770.
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The V2+ doesn't have an analog input, does it?
Nope. You can't use it as an amp-only.
That's sad. I preordered this without knowing the above. How do I use this with my iPhone?
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Maybe this (http://store.apple.com/us/product/MD821ZM/A/lightning-to-usb-camera-adapter).
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2 questions regarding all these update tables:
1.whats the third filter? most of the tech in this new line seems to be trickle down so, for infinity is it the pulse streaming filter? for the sig edition femto filter?
2. what do you mean when you say line out mode?
bonus: for single end is the plus and minus signal summated or is the neg sig shorted?
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I feel a little sad, I got the Geek Out V1 only a little more than a month before this announcement. Baby's first DAC. More likely than not I'll be saving to get the V2 sometime.
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Can't you return it?
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Can't you return it?
Don't think so, I bought it from Massdrop. I probably shouldn't complain though considering I got it for a discount.
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Don't think so, I bought it from Massdrop. I probably shouldn't complain though considering I got it for a discount.
now you know why it was on discount
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Wow, the v2+ is exactly the product I wanted. Any word on how long that battery will last?
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Wow, the v2+ is exactly the product I wanted. Any word on how long that battery will last?
It was mentioned about 13 hours on full blast.
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Was sick home today while the wife and kid visited a museum so I got some quality time with the v2.
First, holy moly this thing is musical. There's tons more information and that fine detail that makes the better DACs so much more engaging is there in spades. I'm not kidding when I say this is among the best DACs I've had in my possession. It's not the Yggy, but I can stuff this in a bag and take it with me on vacation. With the Leckerton and UERM, I've got a rig that goes everywhere with me that sounds GOOD!
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Was sick home today while the wife and kid visited a museum so I got some quality time with the v2.
First, holy moly this thing is musical. There's tons more information and that fine detail that makes the better DACs so much more engaging is there in spades. I'm not kidding when I say this is among the best DACs I've had in my possession. It's not the Yggy, but I can stuff this in a bag and take it with me on vacation. With the Leckerton and UERM, I've got a rig that goes everywhere with me that sounds GOOD!
Pretty excited about that. I just need to figure out a non-IEM, non-Supra-aural that rocks on the go. If nothing else, an Oppo PM-3 perhaps.
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Was sick home today while the wife and kid visited a museum so I got some quality time with the v2.
First, holy moly this thing is musical. There's tons more information and that fine detail that makes the better DACs so much more engaging is there in spades. I'm not kidding when I say this is among the best DACs I've had in my possession. It's not the Yggy, but I can stuff this in a bag and take it with me on vacation. With the Leckerton and UERM, I've got a rig that goes everywhere with me that sounds GOOD!
What Leckerton would you be feeding with the V2? Analog so as to bypass the Leckerton DAC, I imagine...
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What Leckerton would you be feeding with the V2? Analog so as to bypass the Leckerton DAC, I imagine...
Seeing the GO can't be used as a headphone amp, and it can't output digital, I'd expect the analog i/p of the Leck will be used.
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Was sick home today while the wife and kid visited a museum so I got some quality time with the v2.
First, holy moly this thing is musical. There's tons more information and that fine detail that makes the better DACs so much more engaging is there in spades. I'm not kidding when I say this is among the best DACs I've had in my possession. It's not the Yggy, but I can stuff this in a bag and take it with me on vacation. With the Leckerton and UERM, I've got a rig that goes everywhere with me that sounds GOOD!
ZD,
these positive impressions, along with William-The-P indicate a lot of promise for Geek Out V2 and V2+.
however both of you appear to run GOV2 as a DAC into another amp (most frequently).
can either of you differentiate on the Amp section of V2 vs. Leck, or there external IEM amps-
GOV2 Amp is 50/70/90% of other IEM amps or ?
hm when is Dr Cavalli IEM amp going to enter our lives?
thanks for stealing the V2. ignore Casey when he asks for it back, send it to me.
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I feel a little sad, I got the Geek Out V1 only a little more than a month before this announcement. Baby's first DAC. More likely than not I'll be saving to get the V2 sometime.
The 450 is still a very good little unit and just because something comes out that is noticeably different or even better in some regard...doesn't mean that the previously good stuff is suddenly not. I like to get the new stuff in-house and then compare with some time before off-loading the previous. Keep that 450 and enjoy in the meantime, which we think was a big jump up for a USB DAC/Amp or DAC (period). Later, if you get to compare- you may still prefer that one for your uses and might not want the newer one. Sometimes that happens. I'll want to compare under lots of conditions and I may keep or give or sell the 450/720/1000 Geek Outs that I am hoarding right now. :)p15
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For those of you with GO450s, I highly recommend you hang on to them until we can review the 3 gain units. Right now, my current v.2 prototype only does high gain (1000mw). Compared to the v.1 GO1000, it's an obvious improvement across the board. However, the v.1 450 still does some things better when used as a DAC only. Imaging, space and overall resolution are a bit cleaner and delineated. I suspect this is because of the 1000's is still putting out a little more distortion than when pumping out 450mw or 100mw. Where the v.2 1000 improves over the v.1 450 is more organic tone and timbre, more natural ease and musicality, cleaner macrodynamics and blacker background. So you could say these improvements reflect the changes included with the newer chip. The relative analog characteristics and differences between the 1000/720/450/100 still hold it seems to me.
Considering the 3-gain v.2 models will come at a price premium over the GO450 v.1s, I think there is possibly still a case for holding on to them.
The GO v.1s were kind of like this:
GO100-Cleanest of all the GO's, but macro dynamics were notably the softest and least involving.
GO450-The Reference model with the best resolution, imaging, space and air, best combo of clean and accurate macro-dynamic weight, etc., etc.
GO720-Sonics between 450 and 1000, but mostly shared character of the 1000.
GO1000-Biggest bass slam and punch, above neutral sounding, micro stuff and transients more noticeably blurred over compared to the 450.
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Has anyone here tested the GO V1 or V2 prototype with a split USB cable and powered by a battery pack, an LPS or a good SMPS?
I am wondering how much better these USB DAC can sound with a "clean" power supply.
Concerning the rave reviews the GO V2 is gathering here, don't forget that LH Labs will have fine-tuned the prototypes to perfectly match all the components to get the best performance. The production units won't measure as good on average and are likely to feature inferior sound. It's exactly what happened when LH Labs first published the measurements on the Geek Pulse and later could show no improvement for the Geek Pulse Infinity despite heavy performance tweaking.
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Has anyone here tested the GO V1 or V2 prototype with a split USB cable and powered by a battery pack, an LPS or a good SMPS?
I am wondering how much better these USB DAC can sound with a "clean" power supply.
Concerning the rave reviews the GO V2 is gathering here, don't forget that LH Labs will have fine-tuned the prototypes to perfectly match all the components to get the best performance. The production units won't measure as good on average and are likely to feature inferior sound. It's exactly what happened when LH Labs first published the measurements on the Geek Pulse and later could show no improvement for the Geek Pulse Infinity despite heavy performance tweaking.
Not sure why you'd think the production units would not sound as good or even better than the prototype units we have in the field. The measurements for the Geek Pulse Infinity we're an improvement over the Pulse Xfi, actually. Feel free to check the LH Labs forums and research the measurements for yourself in the variety of threads that Larry has published them.
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@Type35: I believe a few people here are using Wyrd with GOv1. I haven't tried this yet with the GOv2. The results will probably vary depending upon a computer's USB implementation and personal preferences.
Sometimes tweaking a product to sound better may result in slightly worse or different looking measurements. Depends upon the measurement. Adding tons of feedback is one way to get more extended frequency response and lower distortion, but collapse the soundstage and kill liveliness. Measurements are great tools, but hardly the end-all-be-all to good sound; and there are probably at least a dozen more measurements being used in the development process that aren't published.
Think of published basic measurements as 0-60 times, skidpad G numbers, and 70-0 braking distance. They tell you something about a car, but not whether you will like driving it or not.
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Personally I prefer the GO without the Wyrd. I prefer the PS Audio PWD with a Wyrd.
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New updates on the V2 & V2+ will be coming out this afternoon. Many of the questions you've asked have been directly answered by Larry and we'll be including them in this update. Also, I'm trying to get him to steal him away for 5 mins and get him on video talking about the latest developments. More to come.
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CEE TEE has the proto I was demoing. He will be posting a review here and at the forbidden place.
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Screw the forbidden place, just give us a decent impressions write up while the long review percolates.
Did the stolen GOV2 have it's low gain (100mW) feature functional or not?
:)p8
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I gotta ask….
How does the GO v2 compare to a budget full size dac like say… bifrost?
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Pretty much the same thing I'm curious about. Don't really care too much about using it as an amp but the impressions are making me interested in getting it as a "spacesaving" DAC.
Am I right in assuming the GO V2 everyone is talking about is the base model and not those with the extra doodads?
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Hard to say. This one wasn't fully optimized for use as a DAC only as the output was locked at ~4.1 volts. That being said, it was super resolving for a little DAC and the only way I'd fault it compared to the V1 is a hint of mids euphony.
I like it better than the bifrost uber I had, but I'd probably get the more expensive $500 V2 infinity for the 450mw/2V output for that use.
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We're very excited to announce that we've made our first shipment of Geek Out V2's ahead of schedule!
Unlike previous crowd-design campaigns, this pre-order campaign was designed to get units shipped out quickly. We want you to enjoy the crap out of these little guys, and can't wait until every unit is in the mail. It won't be long!
Interested in Geek Out V2? https://goo.gl/LGh2KG (https://goo.gl/LGh2KG)
Shipping video update can be found here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IDCZGUv15cU (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IDCZGUv15cU)
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Sorry...posted my impressions in a separate thread in the LH forum...http://www.changstar.com/index.php/topic,2490.0.html (http://www.changstar.com/index.php/topic,2490.0.html)
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You guys may already know this, but I didn't until I had already ponied up my payment in full for the v2+. The only way to get a digital signal into the device is via a Micro usb to micro usb OTG cable, a cable that, according to lh labs "would be very difficult to find" unless you buy a bespoke one from them for $99.00. Moreover, this type of connection is only supported on lollipop, the most recent Android os (don't do ios, but I assume a cck would work). My intent was to use my x3 or x5 as transport and the v2+ as dac/amp. Not so fast, kimosabe. Not a supported application. My tablet? Negatory, even if you buy our cable, not lollipop. Can I get a refund, since it's as portable as the pulse on my desk? Well, yeah, but not until we get all the "data from indigogo". When will that happen? Sorry, you'LL have to open another ticket. That was a little over a week ago. Crickets since.
To be viable for me, and I imagine many others, this thing needs to have more ways to connect digitally than a bespoke cable usable only with lollipop. Coax, optical, something. It appears to have a nice, thin form factor, but if that means no coax in, make it thicker. Couldn't it have a trs digital in? What a stupid design choice. As long as it works with Apple, right? They've got my $280-odd though.
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What tablet do you have? If it supports USB Class 2 Audio, it'll work.
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You guys may already know this, but I didn't until I had already ponied up my payment in full for the v2+. The only way to get a digital signal into the device is via a Micro usb to micro usb OTG cable, a cable that, according to lh labs "would be very difficult to find" unless you buy a bespoke one from them for $99.00. Moreover, this type of connection is only supported on lollipop, the most recent Android os (don't do ios, but I assume a cck would work).
I commented over at head-fi about this too, I can be slightly less impolitic/more direct here.
1. USB-OTG cables aren't hard-to-find at all. Even Amazon is crazy flooded with them. If LH Customer Service told you that USB-OTG cables would be hard to find, I'd like you to reproduce the text of the email here so that we can poke fun at them about it. popcorn
2. USB-OTG has been supported on numerous Android devices since well before Lollipop. Again, if they told you this, send along the messages for entertainment value. I'll direct you to the most complete Android USB-OTG resource on the web, DanBa's USB Audio thread here http://www.head-fi.org/t/595071/android-phones-and-usb-dacs/6735#post_11639134.
In this thread you'll find lists of: purchase ready USB-OTG cables, stock android devices that work with USB DACs, USB DACs that work with Lollipop, UAPP resources, Dogs & Cats living together, etc. etc.
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Copied emails to HF thread. Pease provide a link to an OTG cable that is micro male, to micro male. Amazon only lists micro male to USB type A female. There is no type a male input on the v2+, unlike the V2 and all V1's. Still has to be a lollipop Android device, they (LH) say, which leaves out my phone or any of my many portable players as transport.
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I commented over at head-fi about this too, I can be slightly less impolitic/more direct here.
1. USB-OTG cables aren't hard-to-find at all. Even Amazon is crazy flooded with them. If LH Customer Service told you that USB-OTG cables would be hard to find, I'd like you to reproduce the text of the email here so that we can poke fun at them about it. popcorn
2. USB-OTG has been supported on numerous Android devices since well before Lollipop. Again, if they told you this, send along the messages for entertainment value. I'll direct you to the most complete Android USB-OTG resource on the web, DanBa's USB Audio thread here http://www.head-fi.org/t/595071/android-phones-and-usb-dacs/6735#post_11639134.
In this thread you'll find lists of: purchase ready USB-OTG cables, stock android devices that work with USB DACs, USB DACs that work with Lollipop, UAPP resources, Dogs & Cats living together, etc. etc.
Ticket: https://support.lhlabs.com/helpdesk/tickets/11824
I see Kurt, well i have the V2+ prototype and use the Tidal app for all my hifi music since they have a huge library of audio, pretty much anything i can think of they had. it can also be use for a Apple computer or PC if you have a just a Micro to USB A male.
Best regards Manny,
On Fri, 19 Jun at 3:52 PM , Kurt Hertel <senorx12562@gmail.com> wrote:
Can you guys make a trs (mono) 3.5 mm to micro usb digital cable. That would do the trick.
On Jun 19, 2015 5:47 PM, "Kurt Hertel" <senorx12562@gmail.com> wrote:
Thanks for your time Manny. My phone is a motog, but that's irrelevant, as it only has 8gb of storage and no expansion. My plan all along was to use my fiio x5 as transport only and use the v2+ as dac and amp, as I do with my ifi micro idsd, but apparently i can't use it that way. I also have a Samsung galaxy tab s8.4 which after checking, I see is running android 5.0.2, which I think is lollipop, (they must've updated it while I was asleep, cause it came with 4.4.? In the end, it will be of limited to no utility to me if this will be the only non pc device I can use it with, especially as I can't afford $50 for a bespoke cable. I spent everything I had for the device. Hope it gets good reviews, as I'm apparently gonna have to sell it off as soon as I get it.
Hi Kurt Hertel,
Ticket: https://support.lhlabs.com/helpdesk/tickets/11824
This is new to Lollipop for Android as it was the biggest requested feature for Android operating systems to support audio out as well as Audio in via USB.
At this moment only Lollipop and IOS 6 support this functionality. (without having to do major tweaks to the software of previous versions)
I would like to ask which mobile device you do have and see if anything is available.
Best regards Manny,
On Fri, 19 Jun at 3:28 PM , LH Labs <support@lhlabs.freshdesk.com> wrote:
Hi Kurt Hertel,
Ticket: https://support.lhlabs.com/helpdesk/tickets/11824
On Fri, 19 Jun at 3:27 PM , LH Labs <support@lhlabs.freshdesk.com> wrote:
Hi Kurt Hertel,
Ticket: https://support.lhlabs.com/helpdesk/tickets/11824
The tips are pretty much interchangeable but the most common OTG sold is a USB-A female to Micro male B because there are not many devices that would need both ends to be Micro male B on both ends of the cable.
That is why we have to make our own for our own device. the only thing that actually makes an OTG is grounding one of the pins, check out the diagram.
But instead of a USB-A female we just solder a Micro male B on both ends.
Let me know if this helps at all i should have been more clear about this in your previous ticket.
11824
Kurt Hertel <senorx12562@gmail.com>
Jun 19
to Technical
So for me, it's not really a mobile device. I already have 4 DACs for pcs including a pulse, so I hardly hardly need another. Can you at least find me some direction as to how to rig a 3.5mm mono plug to a cable with a Micro usb plug? Otherwise, you're basically telling me " Tough shit, can't help you dude," correct?
Manny Torres
Jun 19
to me
Hi Kurt Hertel,
Ticket: https://support.lhlabs.com/helpdesk/tickets/11824
That would be a very hard cable to find. I wouldn't leave you with a device you couldn't use. The only issue is that i am unable to refund for this until the campaign is over. ( all the data is on Indiegogo's database till we get it at the end of the campaign).
Best regards Manny,
On Fri, 19 Jun at 4:50 PM , Kurt Hertel <senorx12562@gmail.com> wrote:
So for me, it's not really a mobile device. I already have 4 DACs for pcs including a pulse, so I hardly hardly need another. Can you at least find me some direction as to how to rig a 3.5mm mono plug to a cable with a Micro usb plug? Otherwise, you're basically telling me " Tough shit, can't help you dude," correct?
On Jun 19, 2015 6:41 PM, "Manny Torres" <support@lhlabs.freshdesk.com> wrote:
Hi Kurt Hertel,
Ticket: https://support.lhlabs.com/helpdesk/tickets/11824
I see Kurt, well i have the V2+ prototype and use the Tidal app for all my hifi music since they have a huge library of audio, pretty much anything i can think of they had. it can also be use for a Apple computer or PC if you have a just a Micro to USB A male.
Best regards Manny,
On Fri, 19 Jun at 3:52 PM , Kurt Hertel <senorx12562@gmail.com> wrote:
Can you guys make a trs (mono) 3.5 mm to micro usb digital cable. That would do the trick.
On Jun 19, 2015 5:47 PM, "Kurt Hertel" <senorx12562@gmail.com> wrote:
Thanks for your time Manny. My phone is a motog, but that's irrelevant, as it only has 8gb of storage and no expansion. My plan all along was to use my fiio x5 as transport only and use the v2+ as dac and amp, as I do with my ifi micro idsd, but apparently i can't use it that way. I also have a Samsung galaxy tab s8.4 which after checking, I see is running android 5.0.2, which I think is lollipop, (they must've updated it while I was asleep, cause it came with 4.4.? In the end, it will be of limited to no utility to me if this will be the only non pc device I can use it with, especially as I can't afford $50 for a bespoke cable. I spent everything I had for the device. Hope it gets good reviews, as I'm apparently gonna have to sell it off as soon as I get it.
Hi Kurt Hertel,
Ticket: https://support.lhlabs.com/helpdesk/tickets/11824
This is new to Lollipop for Android as it was the biggest requested feature for Android operating systems to support audio out as well as Audio in via USB.
At this moment only Lollipop and IOS 6 support this functionality. (without having to do major tweaks to the software of previous versions)
I would like to ask which mobile device you do have and see if anything is available.
Best regards Manny,
11824
Kurt Hertel
When is the campaign over?
Jun 19
Stephanie Rodriguez
This is Stephanie at LH labs, thank you for your time. Manny is out for the d...
Jun 22
Manny Torres
Thank you for your time Kurt, So i will put this ticket on freeze, ( it will ...
Jun 24 (12 days ago)
Kurt Hertel <senorx12562@gmail.com>
Jun 24 (12 days ago)
to Technical
Thank you Manny
On Jun 24, 2015 11:36 AM, "Manny Torres" <support@lhlabs.freshdesk.com> wrote:
Hi Kurt Hertel,
Ticket: https://support.lhlabs.com/helpdesk/tickets/11824
Thank you for your time Kurt,
So i will put this ticket on freeze, ( it will show as closed on your end) once the campaign is over we can open it up again and get you that refund once we get the data from Indiegogo. I am glad i was able to help with your questions. Again thank you for your time and support.
Best regards Manny,
On Mon, 22 Jun at 10:23 AM , LH Labs <support@lhlabs.freshdesk.com> wrote:
Hi Kurt Hertel,
Ticket: https://support.lhlabs.com/helpdesk/tickets/11824
This is Stephanie at LH labs, thank you for your time. Manny is out for the day so I will be helping out with his ticket. The campaign is over on June 28th. It will take a few days to get all the data from Indiegogo and sort it out. Let us know if you have any further questions.
Best Wishes,
Stephanie
Customer Happiness Agent
920 Reserve Drive,Suite 160
Roseville, CA 95747
http://www.lhlabs.com
On Fri, 19 Jun at 5:06 PM , Kurt Hertel <senorx12562@gmail.com> wrote:
When is the campaign over?
On Jun 19, 2015 7:04 PM, "Manny Torres" <support@lhlabs.freshdesk.com> wrote:
Hi Kurt Hertel,
Ticket: https://support.lhlabs.com/helpdesk/tickets/11824
That would be a very hard cable to find. I wouldn't leave you with a device you couldn't use. The only issue is that i am unable to refund for this until the campaign is over. ( all the data is on Indiegogo's database till we get it at the end of the campaign).
Best regards Manny,
On Fri, 19 Jun at 4:50 PM , Kurt Hertel <senorx12562@gmail.com> wrote:
So for me, it's not really a mobile device. I already have 4 DACs for pcs including a pulse, so I hardly hardly need another. Can you at least find me some direction as to how to rig a 3.5mm mono plug to a cable with a Micro usb plug? Otherwise, you're basically telling me " Tough shit, can't help you dude," correct?
11824
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See: http://www.ttvjaudio.com/TTVJ_Micro_USB_to_Micro_USB_Portable_Cable_p/aat0000200.htm%22
It was designed for the Apex Glacier, and I'm pretty sure it's a similar use case (usb micro-b to usb micro-b).
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Ok, first, the v2+ will work with whatever devices the v2 will work with. The key is whether it runs USB Class 2 Audio, which several devices (iphones, androids, PCs, macs...) do. This is not exclusive to Lollipop, but is universal on Lollipop.
Second, I understand what I perceive is your frustration over the lack of easily available OTG to micro-b cables, those are not plentiful (although I did find one on a random asian website...). You can bypass this by using an adapter; it is the same thing that those accursed iphone users must do with their awful CCK cables. Nevermind, kudos AV. Third, the cable that I believe he was commenting would be "very hard to find" is an OTG to 3.5mm, which I cannot imagine why anyone would mass produce, or even how you would intend to use it.
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See: http://www.ttvjaudio.com/TTVJ_Micro_USB_to_Micro_USB_Portable_Cable_p/aat0000200.htm%22
It was designed for the Apex Glacier, and I'm pretty sure it's a similar use case (usb micro-b to usb micro-b).
Well, LH told me that it is only functional with ios 6 and lollipop, and I'm not gonna carry around an 8.4 inch tablet as a transport, along with the v2+. I can use my x3 and x5 as transport with my iMicro iDsd as DAC/amp, and I expect that as a minimum for a device that is called "portable."
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This is new to Lollipop for Android as it was the biggest requested feature for Android operating systems to support audio out as well as Audio in via USB.
At this moment only Lollipop and IOS 6 support this functionality. (without having to do major tweaks to the software of previous versions)
Ok, this is a direct quote from the email exchange with Manny @ LH, so I guess if you know better you'd have to talk to LH.
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Dude, your X3 and X5 would need a SPDIF optical to USB converter.
These units have ALWAYS been USB based. I can understand being frustrated with their support if they told you you had to buy a $100 cable, but at this point you're bitching because you didn't read before buying.
I give LH a lot of shit for areas where they can improve, but this is on you. You'll get no sympathy from pirates on this one.
If you'd like a cheap micro to micro OTG cable, these work great:
http://hakshop.myshopify.com/products/micro-to-micro-otg?variant=211796287
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Ok, this is a direct quote from the email exchange with Manny @ LH, so I guess if you know better you'd have to talk to LH.
Well it reads as a direct quote from me, which is a little disconcerting... His point is that devices running Android L will support it, without asterisks or caveats, I am guessing LH makes statements like this to avoid minor pissing matches about "you said it would probably work on my galaxy s[number]! but it doesn't!!" which I can understand. As for iOS 6, I think that is correct, and no prior version of iOS supported it. Separately, I don't know why you are so bent out of shape about using OTG since both of your android devices support it, yet you never intended to use it anyway.
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You guys are not understanding me at all. LH labs has told me in no uncertain terms (it's in the emails I posted), that without either a Android/lollipop device or an ios 6 device with which to use the type of cable they specify the device cannot be used portably. This info was not disclosed before I was forced to pay in full. I use my ifi micro iDSD as DAC/amp for x3 and x5 all day long, no problems. Bad design choice to limit use to lollipop/ios6. And I wasn't looking for sympathy, I was trying to warn people. Once they start arriving and people realize they are shipped without the required cable and my kit cat device won't work even with the correct cable, well, its not gonna be pretty. Too bad, cause I love the sound of my pulse.
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V2+ works with iOS too? do i need camera connection kit for that?
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Yes ios requires a cck, but according to LH, only ios 6 anf lollipop will work, earlier versions will not, at least thats what lh told me. People around here seem to think differently. I wish they could show lh the error of their ways.
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V2+ works with iOS too? do i need camera connection kit for that?
Yes, and yes.
Bad design choice to limit use to lollipop/ios6. And I wasn't looking for sympathy, I was trying to warn people.
The first sentence is a valid criticism of the device, others have been frustrated with this. FYI opt/spdif support in portable amps is limited, Leck UHS-6 is a major standout though... I think the bigger weakness is not V2+ failure to support opt/spdif, but rather its lack of a line in. Still, I jumped in since I intend to use it with my phone(s?) when that is warranted, and laptop when necessary. The second quoted sentence is the problem with your complaint: I think most people who went so far as buying it were aware of these limitations, especially since they have been discussed in several places, including HF and here.
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Dude, your X3 and X5 would need a SPDIF optical to USB converter.
These units have ALWAYS been USB based. I can understand being frustrated with their support if they told you you had to buy a $100 cable, but at this point you're bitching because you didn't read before buying.
I give LH a lot of shit for areas where they can improve, but this is on you. You'll get no sympathy from pirates on this one.
If you'd like a cheap micro to micro OTG cable, these work great:
http://hakshop.myshopify.com/products/micro-to-micro-otg?variant=211796287
Thanks for the link to the cable. It still won't work with anything but my Tablet as transport, which is hardly portable, at least for me.
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Thanks for the link to the cable. It still won't work with anything but my Tablet as transport, which is hardly portable, at least for me.
I get the beef with lack of storage on the phone, I could only use my iphone with streaming services for that reason. What OS is the moto g? It supports USB OTG in Kitkat. You can probably use it with your moto g for streaming services, if you are into that.
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Yes ios requires a cck, but according to LH, only ios 6 anf lollipop will work, earlier versions will not, at least thats what lh told me. People around here seem to think differently. I wish they could show lh the error of their ways.
I am the one who told LH about Lollipop support for USB class 2 audio being a standard feature and they consult with me with regard to Android functionality and feature sets. I am telling you, plenty of other devices support this. LH doesn't officially recommend anything else though since it's very difficult to catalog EVERY device that supports the standard.
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Yes, and yes.
The first sentence is a valid criticism of the device, others have been frustrated with this. FYI opt/spdif support in portable amps is limited, Leck UHS-6 is a major standout though... I think the bigger weakness is not V2+ failure to support opt/spdif, but rather its lack of a line in. Still, I jumped in since I intend to use it with my phone(s?) when that is warranted, and laptop when necessary. The second quoted sentence is the problem with your complaint: I think most people who went so far as buying it were aware of these limitations, especially since they have been discussed in several places, including HF and here.
Yeah my bad. guess I was hoping for (and more fool me, expecting) the kind of design forethought and versatility that ifi put into the micro idsd. My excitement at potentially getting the sq of my pulse on the move combined with the fact that every time I looked away from the IGG campaign the wait was a month or two longer had me not doing my due diligence. Thank god for ebay. Hey, maybe they will actually follow through on their commitment to give me a refund. Stranger things have happened.
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I get the beef with lack of storage on the phone, I could only use my iphone with streaming services for that reason. What OS is the moto g? It supports USB OTG in Kitkat. You can probably use it with your moto g for streaming services, if you are into that.
It says 4.4.2, but running USB OTG Checker app tells me the device does not support USB OTG. I have spotify, but using an outboard DAC with Spotify makes no sense to me. BTW, it's free Spotify.
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Yeah my bad. guess I was hoping for (and more fool me, expecting) the kind of design forethought and versatility that ifi put into the micro idsd. My excitement at potentially getting the sq of my pulse on the move combined with the fact that every time I looked away from the IGG campaign the wait was a month or two longer had me not doing my due diligence. Thank god for ebay. Hey, maybe they will actually follow through on their commitment to give me a refund. Stranger things have happened.
Now that the campaign ended, price jumped by like $150, so if you keep it unopened and cannot return it, you stand a good chance of selling it for what you paid.
It says 4.4.2, but running USB OTG Checker app tells me the device does not support USB OTG. I have spotify, but using an outboard DAC with Spotify makes no sense to me. BTW, it's free Spotify.
I get the hesitance to have a ~$300 device to enjoy 160 ogg, and if that was the only use case that worked for you, I wouldn't recommend it. FWIW, I did some very limited googling, and it seems 4.4.2 had a minor glitch that interrupted OTG functionality on moto g. It appears to be fixed as of 4.4.4, maybe time for an upgrade regardless?
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Now that the campaign ended, price jumped by like $150, so if you keep it unopened and cannot return it, you stand a good chance of selling it for what you paid.
I get the hesitance to have a ~$300 device to enjoy 160 ogg, and if that was the only use case that worked for you, I wouldn't recommend it. FWIW, I did some very limited googling, and it seems 4.4.2 had a minor glitch that interrupted OTG functionality on moto g. It appears to be fixed as of 4.4.4, maybe time for an upgrade regardless?
A phone upgrade, you mean?
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Ok, then how you connect CCK to this thing actually ? one more adapter to connect CCK>V2 ? that sounds very tedious that i'm thinking of just getting android device instead hahahah
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Hey guys. I'm running Android Kit Kat, but I read on Changstar someone said the V2 only works with Lollipop. Do I need an Empirical Offramp to use it with my phone? Thanks. :))
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It was lh labs who said the v2+ only works with Lollipop or ios6.
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Do you buy cars based on what the car salesman tells you too? Like zero said, always do your own research and due diligence. In the end, purchasing decisions are on you and noone else. I don't think this is the first time you've run into reps or CS people who give you incomplete or convenient responses is it? You're talking to drones that have been mostly replaced by machines or the internet.
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A phone upgrade, you mean?
Sure that too, but I meant update your rom. Caveat: I have no idea what your carrier is and whether you can upgrade.
Ok, then how you connect CCK to this thing actually ? one more adapter to connect CCK>V2 ? that sounds very tedious that i'm thinking of just getting android device instead hahahah
Yup. Careful inspection of the CCK cable reveals a termination in standard female USB-A, which will not successfully mate with a female micro-b port. They can love each other, and get married (probably?), but you will not hear anything out of your headphones without an adapter cable.
Hey guys. I'm running Android Kit Kat, but I read on Changstar someone said the V2 only works with Lollipop. Do I need an Empirical Offramp to use it with my phone? Thanks. :))
Yes, as the source of this important information, I support the use of Empirical Offramp for all phone related audio applications, just make sure you have the HDMI regulator option, that shit makes a huge difference.
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Do you buy cars based on what the car salesman tells you too? Like zero said, always do your own research and due diligence. In the end, purchasing decisions are on you and noone else. I don't think this is the first time you've run into reps or CS people who give you incomplete or convenient responses is it? You're talking to drones that have been mostly replaced by machines or the internet.
The question was only finally answered after I had purchased it. Are you saying that they are now incorrect when they say that "only" the lollipop version of Android supports this functionality? Condescending and willfully obtuse much? Geez.
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The question was only finally answered after I had purchased it. Are you saying that they are now incorrect when they say that "only" the lollipop version of Android supports this functionality? Condescending and willfully obtuse much? Geez.
Obtuse? I'm not the one posting multiple times about the V2 'only' working with lollipop after having the original question answered for you about 50 posts ago. You were already about 50mph down the slippery slope of embarrassment before any form of condescension could be considered relevant.
I always find it amusing when self-reflection morphs into projection on forums.
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Maybe I'm missing what exactly the confusion is. You have 4 USB DACS already and bought a fifth USB DAC and are having an issue with LH Labs statement that they've "designed it to be compatible with iOS (with Apple Camera Kit), Android Lollipop 5.0 & USB 2.0 audio class compatible devices" (which doesn't match your intended use with a DAP with a S/PDIF (optical) connection or with a phone on an earlier OS)?
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The question was only finally answered after I had purchased it. Are you saying that they are now incorrect when they say that "only" the lollipop version of Android supports this functionality? Condescending and willfully obtuse much? Geez.
Just ignore him :-)
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I just received my Geek Out V2 in the mail. I don't have much to say about the sound yet, but the build quality is disappointing. It looks really nice from a distance, but up close, the body panels are misaligned and generally fit very poorly, leaving rough, sharp edges all the way around the unit. The body around the output jacks is also very rough-looking. I'm sure this is due to the nature of 3D printing, but the build quality feels like a huge step back from V1.
Operationally, the LED indicators for gain seem to be reversed from what the manual indicates, but at least it handles bit-rate and -depth changes with much more grace than the V1.
Part of me wonders if there's a physical difference between this and the Infinity model, or if it's just firmware differences. Either way, the difference between the two gain levels is small enough that I can't see a benefit in having an intermediate gain level.
Color me unimpressed so far, but we'll see if the sound quality turns things around for me.
Edit: and the SE jack's tightness isn't confidence-inspiring. The buttons also only register presses about 75% of the time.
Jesus Christ, the internals aren't even attached to the body. The body can be wiggled around the internals by a good 1/8th inch from end to end. What a joke.
Edit edit: LH support has confirmed that the manual is wrong about the gain controls. Blue is high gain, white is low.
Edit edit edit: AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA. The body just fell right off. I amend my earlier comment to be "What a fucking joke."
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I just received my Geek Out V2 in the mail. I don't have much to say about the sound yet, but the build quality is disappointing. It looks really nice from a distance, but up close, the body panels are misaligned and generally fit very poorly, leaving rough, sharp edges all the way around the unit. The body around the output jacks is also very rough-looking. I'm sure this is due to the nature of 3D printing, but the build quality feels like a huge step back from V1.
Operationally, the LED indicators for gain seem to be reversed from what the manual indicates, but at least it handles bit-rate and -depth changes with much more grace than the V1.
Part of me wonders if there's a physical difference between this and the Infinity model, or if it's just firmware differences. Either way, the difference between the two gain levels is small enough that I can't see a benefit in having an intermediate gain level.
Color me unimpressed so far, but we'll see if the sound quality turns things around for me.
Edit: and the SE jack's tightness isn't confidence-inspiring. The buttons also only register presses about 75% of the time.
Jesus Christ, the internals aren't even attached to the body. The body can be wiggled around the internals by a good 1/8th inch from end to end. What a joke.
Edit edit: LH support has confirmed that the manual is wrong about the gain controls. Blue is high gain, white is low.
Edit edit edit: AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA. The body just fell right off. I amend my earlier comment to be "What a fucking joke."
Hi Tiohn,
If you open a ticket with our Customer Service department, we'll send you a replacement unit right away. Very sorry that you're less than pleased with your V2. Hopefully we can work to make this right.
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The body is 3-D printed vs Aluminium (in the old Geek Out). I personally would have preferred aluminum, but I don't mind it. In fact, the device is lighter than before because of that, and perhaps puts less of a strain on the USB connector if not using a USB cable.
I'm still getting a short USB cable since I don't want to break things if I accidentally hit the Geek.
It is relatively easy to take the body apart and put together, but it still takes a little bit of effort. In my case it didn't just fell off.
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Hi Tiohn,
If you open a ticket with our Customer Service department, we'll send you a replacement unit right away. Very sorry that you're less than pleased with your V2. Hopefully we can work to make this right.
Thanks, Casey. I've opened a case. Kudos to your support team for so quickly responding to and resolving my first case about the gain indicator LED.
Once I snapped the case back together, it seems less likely to fall apart willy nilly, so maybe it just wasn't seated well out of the box. I assume the mismatched edges between the top and bottom halves of the case are one of the pitfalls of 3D printing.
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Thanks, Casey. I've opened a case. Kudos to your support team for so quickly responding to and resolving my first case about the gain indicator LED.
Once I snapped the case back together, it seems less likely to fall apart willy nilly, so maybe it just wasn't seated well out of the box. I assume the mismatched edges between the top and bottom halves of the case are one of the pitfalls of 3D printing.
They're pretty awesome (the CS team) and usually are on top of new tickets at a lightning fast pace. If you're still not happy with the V2, by all means, send it back and we'll replace it right away.
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Hooray. I sold my GO450 last weekend in anticipation of the V2 arriving this week. RMAing this V2 looks like it will take at least two weeks factoring in shipping both ways, so I'll be without a DAC for that period of time. Wonderful.
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Hooray. I sold my GO450 last weekend in anticipation of the V2 arriving this week. RMAing this V2 looks like it will take at least two weeks factoring in shipping both ways, so I'll be without a DAC for that period of time. Wonderful.
Should have a V2 replacement for you by next week.
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We just posted an update addressing the chassis issue. You can see it here: https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/geek-out-v2-the-world-s-most-powerful-compact-amp/x/6993509#/updates
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It took three weeks, but I finally received my updated/fixed GOV2. I'm disappointed that the RMA process took so much longer than promised, but so far everything is in good order. Knock on wood, but it's been up to operating temperature for about an hour and a half and the chassis seems secure. The chassis is still very shoddy-looking, but I'll get over that. Now we'll see how it actually sounds...
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I am super excited to receive my gov2, will be upgrading from go 450. I already ordered custom balanced cable to use it with my he-560 and also as a dac to my speaker amp. will be comparing it to my go450 and ksa-5 china clone. c'mon lh labs, ship iiiiiiit
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just posted my GOV2+Infinity impressions over in the Boulder CCCP meet thread.
headbang
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I honestly don't think the GOV2 is ready to ship. I finally had a chance to listen to my repaired unit and realized that the low gain LED doesn't work.
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It took three weeks, but I finally received my updated/fixed GOV2. I'm disappointed that the RMA process took so much longer than promised, but so far everything is in good order. Knock on wood, but it's been up to operating temperature for about an hour and a half and the chassis seems secure. The chassis is still very shoddy-looking, but I'll get over that. Now we'll see how it actually sounds...
Any photos of production chassis?
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Here's the best I could do with my phone's camera, but you should be able to see the mismatched edges, messy glue, etc.
(http://i.imgur.com/Zaq5YDXl.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/iQKYL5Al.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/ApBoZQIl.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/pJmDkGul.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/xzM4XTOl.jpg)
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Thanks. Wow, thats :vomit: I much prefer the 'hot' alu V1 chassis...
How do you think the resin will hold up durability wise?
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The resin seems sturdy enough. Since mine arrived with a dead LED, I'm not sure the same could be said for the internals.
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I don't think 3-D printing is ready for prime time yet; that chassis looks like a polished turd.
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(http://i.imgur.com/pJmDkGul.jpg)
I don't think 3-D printing is ready for prime time yet; that chassis looks like a polished turd.
That kind of reminds me of green plastic soldiers that I used to have as a kid...
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Just got a chance to hear the V2+ prototype at the Chicago meet today:
1. The 3-D printed resin chassis sucks, plain and simple. It is lightweight and keeps the unit cool. It doesn't feel durable. It makes menu option text more difficult to read and generally detracts from the user experience in almost every way;
2. It is without a doubt the best sounding portable DAC I've ever heard. They could stick it in an Altoids tin for all I care. I was skeptical when Marv put it on the DAC list above the Bifrost Uber...but it really is that good. I listened to it with a modded HD650, Paradox, ZMF Blackwood, and Oppo PM-3 today. It handled each very well without the assistance of a portable amp. That was just out of the single ended jack as the balanced jack had a red cap on it. Smartphone compatibility: It worked via TTVJ OTG cable with my Note 4.
The V2+ and Oppo PM-3 combo to me seems like a budget no-brainer. I can't believe this thing even uses a Sabre DAC. It sure doesn't sound like one. I'm pretty pumped for my Batch 1 unit's arrival. I wish I'd have ordered a V2+ Infinity perk now.
P.S. Seriously though, they might want to consider that Altoids tin chassis option. Huge step up.
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I completely agree on all accounts. It's the best sounding portable DAC, bar none. As one who's super-sensitive to digital glare, this doesn't have it. It's amp output is fantastic as well. I was enjoying it all day at work with my Enigmas. I absolutely recommend it.
The problem is the case. I have the V2+ Infinity (I think I have all the names and plusses). My first problem is it has air vents which are completely open, which limits where I feel safe bringing the portable. I'm worried about carrying it in my pocket as I'm worried the lint will short out the circuitry. It also gets pretty hot, but that can be managed. While it doesn't feel well built due to the nature of 3D printing, I'm ok with plastic.
I really wish this was an aluminum case. While not the best sound-wise, the best portable DAC/amp design out there is by far the Oppo HA-2. All aluminum with a leather wrap to keep the heat away and not scuff up your phone.
My other complaint as an iPhone user is it requires the camera connection kit. I'm not sure what Oppo did with their HA-2, but it doesn't require it and it's much more convenient.
Basically I want the awesomeness of this DAC in the case of the Oppo HA-2. You can keep the volume knob of the HA-2, even though it's cool.
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Does it get hotter than the GO-450? I think mine gets pretty hot. Still a great amp/DAC.
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Does it get hotter than the GO-450? I think mine gets pretty hot. Still a great amp/DAC.
My GO V2+ gets nowhere near the heat the GO-450 puts out. Only the parts with the vents get warm to the touch, and even then, it's a night and day difference.
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That's the production chassis? :vomit:
Very worried for the Wave...
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The Wave won't be 3D printed or will it?
Just fyi, a few of us here mentioned our concerns with the 3D printed prototypes quite a few times since canjam so can't say we didn't try. :-\
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I completely agree on all accounts. It's the best sounding portable DAC, bar none. As one who's super-sensitive to digital glare, this doesn't have it. It's amp output is fantastic as well. I was enjoying it all day at work with my Enigmas. I absolutely recommend it.
............
+1. I have been spending the entire weekend with the MBA, the GOV2 and the HD 600/800. Just great sound. The amp section is just very good. I am finding it difficult to go back to either the Bifrost Uber or even the Gungnir. Man, the synergy with this dac/amp and the Senns makes for very pleasurable listening.
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So it seems to be a resounding "nice DAC, shame about the chassis"
I sense a modded project box in my future :boom:
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+1. I have been spending the entire weekend with the MBA, the GOV2 and the HD 600/800. Just great sound. The amp section is just very good. I am finding it difficult to go back to either the Bifrost Uber or even the Gungnir. Man, the synergy with this dac/amp and the Senns makes for very pleasurable listening.
Yeah, I thought it got a little too close to the Gungnir for comfort. Totally impressed by the amp section - not sure that running a line out to the Leckerton is going to be necessary.
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The Wave won't be 3D printed or will it?
Just fyi, a few of us here mentioned our concerns with the 3D printed prototypes quite a few times since canjam so can't say we didn't try. :-\
Yes, Wave will have the 3D printed case. For those with the Titanium and Carbon Fibre perk, last I had heard they were looking for a way integrate a back panel for that. I haven't kept up on their own forum since the change over, so I'm not sure if that is still the plan.
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Yeah, I thought it got a little too close to the Gungnir for comfort. Totally impressed by the amp section - not sure that running a line out to the Leckerton is going to be necessary.
Cousin Balki, glad you're hearing it that way. The other tinkering I did was that in my MBA I finally ditched Amarra for Audirvana Plus. Overall system is a lot more stable now with no links/overlays to/on iTunes. A shout out to Needletogroove who had been urging me to do the same.
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GO v2+ Infinity arrived while I was traveling. Charged it up overnight. Getting ready for initial casual listening with new iPod Touch and UERM.
Casework is sticky to the touch. What the heck?
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They're all tacky like that. I've given some feedback on it and some methods to eliminate that in the finishing process.
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Pleasantly surprised to get my Geek Out V2 yesterday. I wasn't expecting it until September technically. Initial physical impressions are that it's smaller than I was thinking which is nice, but the 3D printed case is pretty much crap. It looks and feels really cheap, it's somewhat sticky, and the seams aren't very good. It looks like it will hold up, but it just makes it seem like a college project instead of an actual consumer product. I plugged it in for around 2 hours before actually listening to it and am comparing against the Leckerton UHA-6s mkII used as an all-in-one. The balance, extension, and dynamics are all very good. The Leckerton has bettery clarity and separation though. Didn't get much further than that in testing. I'll try some more tonight and then I also want to see about using the Leckerton just as an amp. Overall it's not bad, though I think probably overpriced at suggested msrp.
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So how did the comparisons go, ocswing? Also, how was the V2 to Leckerton rig?
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Opening the box to find that horrible case would make me feel like a sucker.
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I thought the vents and embossed spiral were cool during the campaign reveal :(
either way I'm looking forward to mine arriving.. sometime
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Going back a long ways to some initial impressions, just wanted to comment on the compressed volume/graduation/ability to flesh out different levels of volume and create musicality... I think I can identify exactly what you guys are describing as I first heard it with the Yggdrasil.
For me, I was shocked at how I could hear how close the singer seemed to be from the microphone on some acoustic and slower songs that I listen to daily. When I played them on the Yggdrasil, instead of simply hearing Chan Marshall's vocals, I heard how she was leaning in at some points, and moving away. It's a subtle effect, but I was really shocked at how the Yggy unmasked what she was doing. It speaks to a level of resolution that is different than other DACs I've heard. If it's also being revealed by the GO V2, sounds like I need to get on the list...
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I thought the vents and embossed spiral were cool during the campaign reveal :(
either way I'm looking forward to mine arriving.. sometime
The design with the vents and treble clef/sine waves are just beautiful. It's just the final execution of the 3D print that fell short, not the idea of it. Lessons learned.
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The design with the vents and treble clef are just beautiful. It's just the final execution of the 3D print that fell short, not the idea of it. Lessons learned.
Lessons that should have been learnt in the R&D stage?, not by disappointing customers. Regardless of Larry Ho's chops and the audio performance of their products, there's a really shady side to these guys, I just hope they are able to ship everything they've sold.
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Lessons that should have been learnt in the R&D stage?, not by disappointing customers. Regardless of Larry Ho's chops and the audio performance of their products, there's a really shady side to these guys, I just hope they are able to ship everything they've sold.
it's gavin fish, that guy is a snake
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it's gavin fish, that guy is a snake
This is just a dick post. Gavin is a genuinely good guy who is one of the rare breed that is constantly thinking about others first. I've known him personally for a while now and he's never shown a remotely shady side.
LH has some supply chain problems. It's true they have a lot of room for improvement in sourcing, especially for chassis (which is the primary thing slowing them down today), but they're trying to make great products because they're excited about audio.
Back to the product at hand, I've been using the Geek Out V2 in balanced and also as a balanced DAC. Great fucking little unit. Might actually pair with a coworker's liquid carbon when it arrives to see how the stack fares.
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This is just a dick post. Gavin is a genuinely good guy who is one of the rare breed that is constantly thinking about others first. I've known him personally for a while now and he's never shown a remotely shady side.
LH has some supply chain problems. It's true they have a lot of room for improvement in sourcing, especially for chassis (which is the primary thing slowing them down today), but they're trying to make great products because they're excited about audio.
Back to the product at hand, I've been using the Geek Out V2 in balanced and also as a balanced DAC. Great fucking little unit. Might actually pair with a coworker's liquid carbon when it arrives to see how the stack fares.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bgK87tmRVeY
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UZIS7IG9rFQ
nuff said
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Dude believes in cables. He worked for MIT cables, he didn't go to MIT.
Although I do make fun of him every time he starts a sentence "When I was at MIT..."
Anyhoos, unlike some other vendors I've interacted with, he's not insecure enough to take what people say about him on the internet personally :). I just figured I'd give you the perspective of someone who has ramped a consumer hardware business and knows what challenges are non-trivial to surmount AND has a lot of personal experience with Gavin and the LH people.
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Yes, Wave will have the 3D printed case. For those with the Titanium and Carbon Fibre perk, last I had heard they were looking for a way integrate a back panel for that. I haven't kept up on their own forum since the change over, so I'm not sure if that is still the plan.
Btw, updates and word is that isn't the case. Heh. Wave will NOT be 3D printed like the Geek Out.
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Btw, updates and word is that isn't the case. Heh. Wave will NOT be 3D printed like the Geek Out.
I saw that. Casey, on HF, had originally said they would be a few months back. I suppose this is good news, based on V2 case feedback. Hopefully we see and hear the final product this year.
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awesome update on the v2+ case: apparently they are adding alu plates to the top and bottom to address some of the "concerns" about vomit inducing 3D printing issues.
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Phew!
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awesome update on the v2+ case: apparently they are adding alu plates to the top and bottom to address some of the "concerns" about vomit inducing 3D printing issues.
Well isn't that nice if you ordered a v2+. I haven't had much time to do additional testing, but overall I like it. I'll be using it as a travel dac/amp for the most part probably. They really need to either find someone else to do the 3d printed case or just go with plastic.
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awesome update on the v2+ case: apparently they are adding alu plates to the top and bottom to address some of the "concerns" about vomit inducing 3D printing issues.
Great news, regardless of the ugliness or flimsiness of the chassis, there's something wrong with that many vents exposing the PCB of a product that will likely be inside someone's pocket.
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Great news, regardless of the ugliness or flimsiness of the chassis, there's something wrong with that many vents exposing the PCB of a product that will likely be inside someone's pocket.
This is my biggest concern. Portable things tend to get near dirt, lint and water. For example your phone probably has had contact with all three multiple times. Something in my pocket should have similar protection. I'm hopeful this is resolved with the aluminum cases. I'm glad to hear LH Labs is listening to us here.
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Thought I'd throw this here so that it's easy to find for search purposes.
The Pinout for the various relevant 3.5mm TRRS Balanced plugs/interconnects are as follows:
Geek Out: L+, R+, L-, R-
HiFiMan: L+, R+, L-, R-
Oppo: L+, R+, L-, R-
All good, right? One more:
Red Wine Audio (for RWAK units): L+, L-, R+, R-
Make sure not to buy any of the last one or else you're going to waste money and potentially damage your shit.
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I have a conundrum. My GOV2 is significantly louder (more power?) when playing from my windows laptop than it is from my macbook pro. Both are playing from Roon. I don't recall this being an issue with my GO450, but I may just not have noticed it at that point. From the macbook pro, 75% volume with high gain from the SE plug is comfortable, whereas I can't turn it up past 30% or so on the windows machine.
What might be causing this?
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Thats weird because macs have some juice from their usb. I mean for example they can charge an ipad air while most laptops can't. I don't know if that directly relates to this though.
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The Macbook is pretty old at this point, 2009, but the usb ports are rated at the full 500ma/5V USB spec.
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The GO would be very broken if more current from the USB resulted in more volume at the same settings.
The simplest answer is the most likely one, that the Windows machine setup is scaling the volume differently than the Mac machine, and increasing beyond 100% early in the volume control.
You might consider digging into where 100% is established on each machine and set the volume there. To go beyond 100% would likely result in worse performance.
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I have a conundrum. My GOV2 is significantly louder (more power?) when playing from my windows laptop than it is from my macbook pro. Both are playing from Roon. I don't recall this being an issue with my GO450, but I may just not have noticed it at that point. From the macbook pro, 75% volume with high gain from the SE plug is comfortable, whereas I can't turn it up past 30% or so on the windows machine.
What might be causing this?
I wish I knew. I have a 2014 Macbook, and my GO 450 also plays a lot louder when the Mac is booted into Windows 7 rather than OSX. It also plays a lot louder when it's connected to my Android phone. I don't think it's a hardware issue. LH Labs wasn't able to help me, and neither was Apple support.
The GO would be very broken if more current from the USB resulted in more volume at the same settings.
The simplest answer is the most likely one, that the Windows machine setup is scaling the volume differently than the Mac machine, and increasing beyond 100% early in the volume control.
You might consider digging into where 100% is established on each machine and set the volume there. To go beyond 100% would likely result in worse performance.
You're probably right about it being something like that, Apple support did tell me something about how OSX and Windows probably just manage volume differently. 100% on Windows would probably be way too loud to listen to safely though.
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My GOV2 volume sounds the same on my 2013 Mac Book Air, and my Windows 10 laptop...
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The simplest answer is the most likely one, that the Windows machine setup is scaling the volume differently than the Mac machine, and increasing beyond 100% early in the volume control.
I'll go with it being a difference between how OSX and Windows handle volume control, but I think that OSX is way undershooting 100% volume. I would assume that 60% volume in high gain would be ridiculously loud on the UERM, so that doesn't seem right.
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I'll go with it being a difference between how OSX and Windows handle volume control, but I think that OSX is way undershooting 100% volume. I would assume that 60% volume in high gain would be ridiculously loud on the UERM, so that doesn't seem right.
Yeah, that's really strange. My gut says that there might be a conflict with your Core Audio volume level and the application volume level. When I used the V2+ on my rMBP, it was impossibly loud by 10-15% on high gain using an HD650/Paradox. The UERM would be unwearable.
If you haven't already, you might want to go into Audio Devices/Audio MIDI setup and see if the master volume/ch.1 &2 volume settings are off.
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So I've narrowed it down to using exclusive mode in Roon. If I turn off exclusive mode, I can max the device volume in Audio Midi Setup and then the application volume causes the volume levels to behave just like in Windows. Oddly, JRiver and Audirvana run the lowered volume level whether I have exclusive mode set or not. HQPLayer brings it's own batch of stupid. I have no idea what people see in it.
I've submitted support tickets with both LH Labs and Roon. I fully expect both of them to blame the other.
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I think I figured it out. It appears that the two different methods of volume control simply have different volume curves. I can't measure it, but max volume sounds like it's the same level whether I'm using hardware or software volume control. Hardware volume control seems to get louder more slowly through low volumes and then ramp up quickly the nearer you get to max volume, while the software volume gets louder more quickly through the lower part of the scale and then more slowly as you get near the top end of the scale.
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Hey guys,
We're looking at getting some Geek Out V2 impressions on our Amazon product page. Feel free to hop over here and post your reviews or simply rate the product. Just know that the chassis issue is something that we are addressing, we know it's a hot topic.
Anyhow, here's the link to the Geek Out V2 on Amazon: http://www.amazon.com/dp/B013KX2R9A
Give it a review (positive or negative....but hopefully positive) and there will be something in it for you down the road
Looking forward to your impressions.
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You'd better fix that case before selling on Amazon.
While (most of) us - Audiophools - focus on sound quality over look, it is clear that you will hear complaint from the Amazon users - expecting something similar to what's on the picture - when they get their hands on the rough 3D printed case...
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Give me a few Casey. Just have to finish up another review first. ;)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b38JALqnEKk
"CAUTION-SPLASH BACK
ByCamden legacyon December 24, 2014
I was gifted poo-purri for Christmas. I decided to give it a go. I followed the directions and then began to do my business. I must warn you that when using poo-purri splash back from you poo will cause irritation and burning on your heiny-hole. Use caution while using this product."
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Fun fact, another pirate gave me poo pourri as a gag gift and it actually ended up being pretty awesome!
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Just know that the chassis issue is something that we are addressing, we know it's a hot topic.
What does this mean? I know you're changing the chassis on the V2+, but do you have something planned for the V2? I'll gladly give mine up for another two weeks if it means I'll get a better chassis out of the deal.
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Has anyone compared the amp section of the V2 vs Leckerton using UERM?
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I use both together with UERM. The balanced out is pretty good though. Leckerton improves the SE out.
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I just received my Crowd Funded V2 Infinity. Followed the V2's instructions very, very carefully and discovered that the V2's lights and buttons worked nicely and the V2 was recognized correctly in my Mac and Tidal Preferences, but that's about it. No music or sound made its way to the speaker end of my headphones.
As a comparison, music played very nicely on both of my Macs when using my three other DAC/Amps (including a Geek Out 1000) and 6 of my better headphones... But not the expensive toy-like V2 Infinity. Seems DOA with cute little lights and buttons that work nicely.
Am I missing something?
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I just received my Crowd Funded V2 Infinity. Followed the V2's instructions very, very carefully and discovered that the V2's lights and buttons worked nicely and the V2 was recognized correctly in my Mac and Tidal Preferences, but that's about it. No music or sound made its way to the speaker end of my headphones.
As a comparison, music played very nicely on both of my Macs when using my three other DAC/Amps (including a Geek Out 1000) and 6 of my better headphones... But not the expensive toy-like V2 Infinity. Seems DOA with cute little lights and buttons that work nicely.
Am I missing something?
Just tossing this out as a hail mary: Audio MIDI Setup, Click the Geek Out V2 Infinity, click the output tab, and then see if Mute is checked on Master, 1, or 2.
Sometimes, Macs just decide to mute things in the MIDI settings on first plug-in for no reason whatsoever.
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Just tossing this out as a hail mary: Audio MIDI Setup, Click the Geek Out V2 Infinity, click the output tab, and then see if Mute is checked on Master, 1, or 2.
Sometimes, Macs just decide to mute things in the MIDI settings on first plug-in for no reason whatsoever.
The Mute thing has happened once to me, when I plugged the GEVO2 in during the login in screen. It s worth a shot...
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my gov2 was delivered on friday, I'm loving it. except it doesn't work with my wyrd. music plays for a while, then I get a tone and I have to power off the wyrd
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my gov2 was delivered on friday, I'm loving it. except it doesn't work with my wyrd. music plays for a while, then I get a tone and I have to power off the wyrd
That thing sure does live up to its name.
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Thanks AustinValentine for the really great suggestion. I did check the MIDI Mute. My other DACs work fine, but not the expensive little black plastic thing with lights and buttons. I really hope that I did overlook something ::)