CHANGSTAR: Audiophile Headphone Reviews and Early 90s Style BBS
Lobby => Headphone Measurements => Topic started by: Marvey on October 06, 2013, 05:58:45 PM
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(http://cdn.head-fi.org/1/1f/900x900px-LL-1f817fed_IMG_0367.jpeg)
STOCK VELOUR PADS HE-500
(http://www.changstar.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=1154.0;attach=4025;image)
STOCK PLEATHER PADS (including the foam disc)
(http://www.changstar.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=1154.0;attach=4027;image)
JERG / MODULAR PADS. Latest version. Full mods including vents and double-sided tape.
(http://www.changstar.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=1154.0;attach=4029;image)
^Awesome.
- No more dip
- Smoother response
- More open sounding
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Thanks again Marv for taking the time out of your busy schedule to do these measurements (as well as breaking your HE500s along the way :(). Mind also tacking on the CSDs you measured?
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CSDs.
NOTE: Ignore "ortho wall" ringing at 3kHz. This artifact appears to be seen with ortho diaphragms which have been tensioned, e.g. Audeze. The greater the tension, the higher this resonance. At least that's what the reside ortho gurus here suspect. I personally don't think it's audible.
STOCK VELOUR
(http://www.changstar.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=1154.0;attach=4032;image)
STOCK PLEATHER
(http://www.changstar.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=1154.0;attach=4034;image)
JERG
(http://www.changstar.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=1154.0;attach=4036;image)
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Thanks again Marv for taking the time out of your busy schedule to do these measurements (as well as breaking your HE500s along the way :( ). Mind also tacking on the CSDs you measured?
Feel free to post on anywhere else on the Internet, but please photoshop a "Copyright 2013 Changstar.com" onto the image if you choose to do so.
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Wow the measurements look great. I need to try a pair with the mod.
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Thanks again Marv for taking the time out of your busy schedule to do these measurements (as well as breaking your HE500s along the way :( ). Mind also tacking on the CSDs you measured?
Feel free to post on anywhere else on the Internet, but please photoshop a "Copyright 2013 Changstar.com" onto the image if you choose to do so.
Will do!
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that looks really amazing. should really try to get to hear these for real.
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Can any generalizations be made with regard to how these pads sound in themselves? That is, will the pleather pads make a different headphone sound brighter as well?
I'm excited to hear these on the HE500 as well
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I wouldn't say brighter - but more airy and open. There's a certain congested feeling with the HFMs and even the Audezes. These pads tend to open things up. I believe dbel took a similar type of approach (in terms of effect) with his LCD3 mods.
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Does not help with slow bass unfortunately. But otherwise seems very good =)
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Does not help with slow bass unfortunately. But otherwise seems very good =)
If you want faster bass you could just roll it off :)p3. Any slowness in HE500's bass don't really show through measurements IMO so I don't know quite know what you mean.
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Power Amp! I'm serious about it. http://www.changstar.com/index.php/topic,732.0.html (http://www.changstar.com/index.php/topic,732.0.html)
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I'm really loving the HE-500 and Mad Dog on my vintage receiver. I haven't had the means to try the HE-500 from the speaker taps, but it still sounds fantastic with the HE-500 + JergPads. Hell, the receiver could probably use a good restoration as well, but there's definitely something about power amps/receivers and headphones that just go really well together from what I can tell. (My Sansui 5000A might not measure the best on paper, but it still did surprisingly well on the HPO over my crappy PC sound card loopback measurement setup and given the fact it's 40+ years old with an unknown level of internal work done on it.)
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Power Amp! I'm serious about it. http://www.changstar.com/index.php/topic,732.0.html (http://www.changstar.com/index.php/topic,732.0.html)
You know, I tried! Not with He-500, but with HE-6 and some other 'phones. It was Pioneer A-717mk2. And just a quick listen on Pioneer A-0012 (it is dual-mono, so only one channel working, lol). Well, I can say, it was not worth it :) Good separate headphone amps were better. Possibly not the best examples, but that's the only I have.
Since then, and Shiit Lyr, I do not believe that power is really the problem driving ortho's. Lyr was a disappointment with orthos, I was wondering what that 6 watts of power really do there.
Not that I do not believe in CA2, it is quite possibly driving HE-500 well. :D But I'm pretty sure not a single amp can correct it's bass in the way I like it to be. I better go with LCD-2 for this, but even there, I only once heard the bass to my liking.
If you want faster bass you could just roll it off :)p3. Any slowness in HE500's bass don't really show through measurements IMO so I don't know quite know what you mean.
Hm, Isn't this continuous low frequency waterfall on csd plots not indicating slow bass behavior? I was pretty sure it is :-Z
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Hm, Isn't this continuous low frequency waterfall on csd plots not indicating slow bass behavior? I was pretty sure it is :-Z
The waterfall plots only have the very top end of the bass region on them. I'm guessing once you go below 200Hz you'll never see the noise floor.
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Oh, correct, did not notice it is cut-out at 200hz
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For going below 200 Hz you would need a very, very long impulse response and window. I'm talking seconds here, like 2^20 samples.
Not impossible of course.
The subbass D3 boost is likely related to now slightly asymmetrical airflow. Any way this can be improved?
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For going below 200 Hz you would need a very, very long impulse response and window. I'm talking seconds here, like 2^20 samples.
Not impossible of course.
The subbass D3 boost is likely related to now slightly asymmetrical airflow. Any way this can be improved?
Like Marv said, the D3 boost is negligible in practice, so I won't bother looking into it. You could though (if you are OCD about it >:D)!
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For going below 200 Hz you would need a very, very long impulse response and window. I'm talking seconds here, like 2^20 samples.
Not impossible of course.
The subbass D3 boost is likely related to now slightly asymmetrical airflow. Any way this can be improved?
Seal the back vents with electrical tape.
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For going below 200 Hz you would need a very, very long impulse response and window. I'm talking seconds here, like 2^20 samples.
Not impossible of course.
The subbass D3 boost is likely related to now slightly asymmetrical airflow. Any way this can be improved?
Seal the back vents with electrical tape.
You sure? It doesn't seem to help with HE500, in the other thread where you measured variations of the mod, not relative to open vents + stickers at least
http://www.changstar.com/index.php/topic,1137.msg30594.html#msg30594
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It helps a little bit; but honestly I wouldn't bother with it on the HE-500 unless you listen to pure 32Hz bass tones.
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It helps a little bit; but honestly I wouldn't bother with it on the HE-500 unless you listen to pure 32Hz bass tones.
I'm surprised at how different the D3 looks between the stickers vs no stickers plots (both with open vents) though; do you believe it's just a measurement artifact or are taping the pads down really lowering low frequency distortion in this case?
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Better seal / dampening. Air leakage between the flimsy easily deformed plastic ring and the housing of the cup of the stock HFM pads. I mean, you can see the gaps.
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Better seal / dampening. Air leakage between the flimsy easily deformed plastic ring and the housing of the cup of the stock HFM pads. I mean, you can see the gaps.
That's been my assumption as well since the beginning, heck I only tried this because I knew Audeze does this with their earpads (and coincidentally have ridiculous bass extension), and because I knew the backvents were causing the pads to be propped even further apart from touching the cups.
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Did this mod today, I really like the extra transparency this brought:
(http://cdn.head-fi.org/7/73/73050b8e_IMG_0578s.jpeg)
Basically just a felt disc, with very specific cutouts so that the open portions of the driver are still open, and the magnet/steel portions are covered (by double-sided tape). The intention is to damp away backwaves from the face when wearing the headphones. Subjectively the upper midrange gets a lot "clearer" sounding with this.
I got the idea to do this when I just did the whole foam disc thing on the driver, initially to tame the treble slightly, but it only partially tamed it and ended up sounding tizzy. At the same time though I noticed a completely separate effect - that the midrange sounded clearer and more open - which did not make much sense as I was covering up the drivers with the fabric, but it came to light that it could be reverberation-related, so I arrived at this.
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Hey, you stole my idea in progress on my next iteration of Abyss tweaks.
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Hey, you stole my idea in progress on my next iteration of Abyss tweaks.
Hehe oops. I promise you I did not think upon your idea at all when I did this mod in one go this morning, not consciously anyway.
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Actually, I figured that was going to be your next step since we had been discussing the fazor stuff.
What would be nice is if a handy cutout or cookie stamp (on Creatology foam, etc.) can be made to mass produce the item.
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How would this play with the Audeze cans? The grill over the magnetic structure is much more simple compared to the hifman line. The new fazor damping/diffusers in the new X line seem to be exactly what this is, but the old LCD2 and LCD3 don't have them.
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Actually, I figured that was going to be your next step since we had been discussing the fazor stuff.
What would be nice is if a handy cutout or cookie stamp (on Creatology foam, etc.) can be made to mass produce the item.
I'd say a simple printable template would be a good start, just print it on some sort of paper with an adhesive backing, bind it to felt/creat. foam, and cut out the pattern on the felt/foam through the paper. That would definitely be much easier than what I did which was using chalk to roughly mark down where the openings are and then cutting out the openings without any real guidance.
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Interesting, the wooliness of the bass sounds quite diminished by this too.
Not completely gone, at least not when A/Bed against my HE400. But it is a noticible improvement compared to before. The specific segment I test this with is what Marv noted in the HE500 wooliness thread (the beginning section of 'If I Were You' by K.D. Lang). In my other usual bassy test tracks that improvement does propagate too.
How would this play with the Audeze cans? The grill over the magnetic structure is much more simple compared to the hifman line. The new fazor damping/diffusers in the new X line seem to be exactly what this is, but the old LCD2 and LCD3 don't have them.
Audeze's magnet retaining assembly grill is functionally identical to Hifiman's, really. It's just that the driver design of HE4/5/5LE/500/6 try to utilize as much of the membrane surface area as possible for conductor tracings, while Audeze opts to only use a central rectangular area of the circular membrane for the tracings. Abyss' driver design is like Audeze's in that respect.
All it means is you need a different damping cutout for HFM drivers compared to Audeze/Abyss's.
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Actually, I figured that was going to be your next step since we had been discussing the fazor stuff.
What would be nice is if a handy cutout or cookie stamp (on Creatology foam, etc.) can be made to mass produce the item.
My wife uses this cutter for her crafts. It's insanely good at what it does, and cutting stuff like creatology foam is exactly what it does well. The layout is super easy in the supplied software.
http://www.silhouetteamerica.com/shop/silhouette-cameo (http://www.silhouetteamerica.com/shop/silhouette-cameo)
Not that I've confirmed I like the Anax mod in my HD-800 I'm going to cut them properly using the Silhouette. All you need is the dimensions. Once you have the drawings right, you could rip out duplicates pretty quickly, and maximize the amount of pieces per sheet as well.
Not cheap, so not likely you want one unless you have some uses for it. One nice thing about it is you can drop a pen in place of the cutting knife and use it as a plotter. I've been laying out my chassis stuff on this now. It's a surprisingly good and quite capable machine.
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Good idea on that mod! I've got a lot of spare Creatology foam around, haha, so I'll give it a shot. Hopefully it isn't too thick.
I've also considered applying foam to the tiny bit of bare plastic on the inside of the cups (back side). I doubt it would make a big difference, but it makes for one less reflective area.
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Good idea on that mod! I've got a lot of spare Creatology foam around, haha, so I'll give it a shot. Hopefully it isn't too thick.
I've also considered applying foam to the tiny bit of bare plastic on the inside of the cups (back side). I doubt it would make a big difference, but it makes for one less reflective area.
I don't think that's too relevant, mainly because of the angle. Whatever reflects off of it from the drivers is going out the backside anyway.
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Any thoughts on Creatology foam (also have a ton of spare) vs. felt? Felt would seem to be slightly more "absorbtive" than the foam.
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I used both materials sandwiched together in the Abyss mod.
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Hi.
This is my first post so I want to say hello to everyone.
I have hifiman he-500 phones (driven by rotel rb 1080 amplifier) and I was curious if someone tried to attatched stock velour pads to those phones just like audeze (with ring of 3m duoble sided tape)?
http://www.head-fi.org/t/586157/audeze-lcd-2-vegan-earpads-feedback-installation-mini-review
It will be interesting to see what will change if those phones would have better seal (with even less sound leakage than stock pads)- completely opposite to jerg mods.
E.
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Hi.
This is my first post so I want to say hello to everyone.
I have hifiman he-500 phones (driven by rotel rb 1080 amplifier) and I was curious if someone tried to attatched stock velour pads to those phones just like audeze (with ring of 3m duoble sided tape)?
http://www.head-fi.org/t/586157/audeze-lcd-2-vegan-earpads-feedback-installation-mini-review
It will be interesting to see what will change if those phones would have better seal (with even less sound leakage than stock pads)- completely opposite to jerg mods.
E.
There is no seal if you use velour pads lol. The velour is completely leaky.
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You are right but there is also a leak from back of pad (there is a slight space beetween pad and headphone so one can easly twist them- some sound can leak from that side too). Anyway I glued mine and I can say that sound is more analitical with less bass. So now they are less musical but faster.
First I glued only one channel to compare it to other side (I used singen 2.1). Bass was different (less bass in glued side but also sound of bass was different). Then I glued other side and listen to music.
I was wondering how it might look on the graph. Maybe I'll try it with pleathers too.
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You are right but there is also a leak from back of pad (there is a slight space beetween pad and headphone so one can easly twist them- some sound can leak from that side too). Anyway I glued mine and I can say that sound is more analitical with less bass. So now they are less musical but faster.
First I glued only one channel to compare it to other side (I used singen 2.1). Bass was different (less bass in glued side but also sound of bass was different). Then I glued other side and listen to music.
I was wondering how it might look on the graph. Maybe I'll try it with pleathers too.
If you consult my Jergpad mod on Head-fi, you'll see that I opt to have double-sided tape adhered to the mounting rings rather than the pads, thus it still ends up having full pad-cup contact despite the plastic mounting rings sandwiched in-between.
I didn't do that for the sake of seal though, in fact IMO HE500 sounds best without full seal, at least with stock Hifiman earpads. Most of HE500's frequency response is damped well enough by air.
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Got some Creatology adhesive-backed stiff felt (quite thick also) over the weekend and redid the baffle diffusion modification more precisely, with all the measurements and stuff.
It's startling how much finesse my HE500s have now. Everything sounds really clean and precise.
(http://cdn.head-fi.org/a/af/900x900px-LL-afaa5d20_IMG_0593s.jpeg)
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I have done something similar to this with the LCD3 - it really works well ..dB
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Agree that the HE-500 is very clean and precise with the felt mod. I rolled some RTC E188CC in the Lyr after doing the mod (to be redone with the same Creatology felt) and it's simply beautiful. Definitely worth the effort. And those tubes demand the back vent mod be reintroduced as well.
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I have done something similar to this with the LCD3 - it really works well ..dB
Oh. Cool! Convergent modding, as they say.
Care to elaborate on other tricks you used on your supposedly magical LCD3s? PM me if you want to keep things relatively private p;).
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I think I might try this on my HE-6 with adhesive-backed acoustic foam.
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Cups? Where we're going, we don't need cups.
Seriously, just remove that bit of a plastic. It's completely optional and that even might do something to the sound.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=flge_rw6RG0
I wonder if cotton can be used instead. I don't have correct kind of felt or foam.
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Cups? Where we're going, we don't need cups.
Seriously, just remove that bit of a plastic. It's completely optional and that even might do something to the sound.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=flge_rw6RG0
I wonder if cotton can be used instead. I don't have correct kind of felt or foam.
If you have a Michael's or any other arts/crafts store near where you live, you could pick up some Creatology adhesive-backed felt/foam probably. I don't see how cotton can be used without blocking the open parts of the driver slits as well.
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Completing the symmetry...
(http://cdn.head-fi.org/0/01/900x900px-LL-01745d4a_IMG_0602s.jpeg)
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LOL, jerg, you made my "mistake" ;-)
I redid the felt mod tonight, and decided I'd redo the outer frame, too. I used the thinner, more flexible felt for that part. It was actually easier to work with, esp. peeling off the backing, but the stiff, thicker felt should absorb more back waves.
Do you notice any difference with the outer felt? I admit I redid it mostly to mask the frame as seen through the grill, but I thought the HE-500 sounded fine with the first version of the mod. The Creatology felt beats the hell out of double stick tape + regular felt. When I pulled the cups I found several pieces had become dislodged. Same under the grills. Not sure how long they'd been like that.
One question: I notice in your felt mod photo that you had unscrewed the plastic(?) ring around the driver. Is that a permanent mod for you? If so, what are the effects?
Cheers.
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LOL, jerg, you made my "mistake" ;-)
I redid the felt mod tonight, and decided I'd redo the outer frame, too. I used the thinner, more flexible felt for that part. It was actually easier to work with, esp. peeling off the backing, but the stiff, thicker felt should absorb more back waves.
Do you notice any difference with the outer felt? I admit I redid it mostly to mask the frame as seen through the grill, but I thought the HE-500 sounded fine with the first version of the mod. The Creatology felt beats the hell out of double stick tape + regular felt. When I pulled the cups I found several pieces had become dislodged. Same under the grills. Not sure how long they'd been like that.
One question: I notice in your felt mod photo that you had unscrewed the plastic(?) ring around the driver. Is that a permanent mod for you? If so, what are the effects?
Cheers.
I only unscrewed the driver-securing plastic rings to get better access to the drivers when I applied the felt strips, it's not really necessary.
Actually I opted for the thick felt for the outer faces of the drivers too, just because I had the extra cutout patterns drawn out on them when I planned the inner felt damping.
And no, the felt for the outer faces of the drivers don't really do much, and they shouldn't, since they are damping minimal amounts of sound compared to the driver side facing the cheeks.
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Had a feeling that's why you did it. Interesting you used a pattern. I just measured (4mm width for the long strips), cut along a line, made sure they weren't too wide, then trimmed to fit before affixing. By the time I was on the outer frames, I was flying along. New, smallish, sharp, precise Fiskar scissors really helped.
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Hmm, Jerg "Fuzzor" (TM) has me inspired. Will scan the headphone driver to make a cutout pattern.
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Hmm, Jerg "Fuzzor" (TM) has me inspired. Will scan the headphone driver to make a cutout pattern.
You're awesome.. thanks Purrin!
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Cups? Where we're going, we don't need cups.
Seriously, just remove that bit of a plastic. It's completely optional and that even might do something to the sound.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=flge_rw6RG0
I wonder if cotton can be used instead. I don't have correct kind of felt or foam.
If you have a Michael's or any other arts/crafts store near where you live, you could pick up some Creatology adhesive-backed felt/foam probably. I don't see how cotton can be used without blocking the open parts of the driver slits as well.
Unfortunately the two shops I know around here don't sell such foam. Silly Poland, even artist have it bad here. :potato:
I could find 2mm art adhesive rubber foam (not Creatology, Moosgummi), that might be it? Looks like fused smooth surface. Alternatively, adhesive 5mm acoustic foam (looks like typical acoustic open cell) and 1.6mm adhesive "mousepad" rubber foam (looks like closed cell or mostly closed cell).
About cotton, I thought about cotton pads, not straightforward unwoven cotton.
Those can be cut given a sharp enough knife, but is 3mm thickness too thick?
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You guys have me interested!
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You guys have me interested!
You really should do the Jergpad mod first before doing any of these "secondary" mods, if you haven't already.
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You really should do the Jergpad mod first before doing any of these "secondary" mods, if you haven't already.
I'm using the Audeze "Vegan" pads on my HE-6. Sounds significantly better. I dislike leather/pleather pads.
(http://www.head-fi.org/content/type/61/id/975571/width/350/height/700/flags/LL/)
If adding that felt improves the mids then I'll do it in a heartbeat. Looks like Armaegis has volunteered to to be the guinea pig for his HE-6. I shall follow if results are good.
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I can't imagine it would hurt the sound in any way. I'm currently running jergpad-ish modded alpha pads (I'll need to get a second pair for the Mad Dog now...). By that, I mean I cut open holes in the bottom of the pads, trimmed the pad "lip" so the fit more easily, did the adhesive mod, and have the back vents in place.
Yesterday, I also cut several slits on the outside of the pads and the "front" part that seals on your head. That was mostly inspired by the optional jergpad step where holes are cut on the outside of the pleather pad, though part of it was just to see what would happen. I am planning on finding a way to adhere a velour or other fabric overlay on the pads, but that will take some more thought than the official jergpads.
There are two main differences between the HFM pleather jergpads and the jergpad-ish alpha pads. The alpha pads sound much more open and less like a wall of sound next to each ear, and I've found myself instinctively reaching for my receiver to make sure I didn't accidentally have the speakers on. They also sound more laid-back, both in terms of bass and treble. I'm almost positive the treble hump around 8-10KHz is not as strong as with the HFM pleather jergpads, and it sounds a bit more natural to my ears
As for the bass response, I'm having a hard time identifying what's going on with it. The official jergpads give the sound noticeably more weight, heft, and rumble, granted the jergpads also bring a tasteful bass hump and extra HD to the table. I honestly don't remember what either of the stock pads sounded like on the HE-500 because neither of them really "worked" well for me (probably the same things jerg heard with stock pads and his reasoning behind the mods). The velour was good, I remember, but I also knew I was going to be cutting it up shortly for the jergpads.
The jergpad-ish alpha pads, on the other hand, remind me more of the HD598. They don't lack bass necessarily, but it's right at that point where it's hard for me to tell if the bass has enough presence and/or if it rolls off a bit. I do miss the official jergpads in that regard, but the additional comfort, more laid-back sound, and more open sound brought by the modded alpha pads keep me from switching back.
Those slits I added to the pads yesterday seem to have help fill in the treble dip somewhat. Without those, you could still hear a dip rather well in SineGen, and it sounded less defined than I remembered after making those slits. Could be wrong...wasn't optimal testing conditions like I had done the first time. I'm sure that dip also contributes to the more laid-back sound. The slits might have also help bring back a bit of bass presence, but I kept flip flopping on whether or not it changed much. So, realistically, probably didn't change much there.
Once I get a chance to make it out for errands, I'll probably pick up some adhesive felt and do these additional mods. My custom wood cups are currently being shipped from over seas.
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You really should do the Jergpad mod first before doing any of these "secondary" mods, if you haven't already.
I'm using the Audeze "Vegan" pads on my HE-6. Sounds significantly better. I dislike leather/pleather pads.
(http://www.head-fi.org/content/type/61/id/975571/width/350/height/700/flags/LL/)
If adding that felt improves the mids then I'll do it in a heartbeat. Looks like Armaegis has volunteered to to be the guinea pig for his HE-6. I shall follow if results are good.
Oh you have the HE6s, not the HE500s. My bad. Yeah no the earpad mod I composed is specific toward HE500 and fixing its unique issues (HE6 has a totally different profile and is probably incompatible).
The "Fuzzor" aka backwave diffusing felt mod should be ubiquitous for ANY headphone though, it makes sense if you think about what it does.
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Oh you have the HE6s, not the HE500s. My bad. Yeah no the earpad mod I composed is specific toward HE500 and fixing its unique issues (HE6 has a totally different profile and is probably incompatible).
The "Fuzzor" aka backwave diffusing felt mod should be ubiquitous for ANY headphone though, it makes sense if you think about what it does.
The felt definitely makes sense. Even removing and reapplying the little piece of stock felt had a noticeable change in the treble and midrange. Brought the midrange forward a bit.
(http://cdn.head-fi.org/2/2c/900x900px-LL-2c52930c_DSC_01941.jpeg)
Where did you buy your felt? It's going to be a lot harder to remove my pads than install that felt...
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I might as well post it here too:
I observed a slight caveat with the felt backwave damping modification ONLY if one uses the stiffened felt, that is somehow because it is so rigid, it acts as a waveguide too well especially for the treble region, and so the end sound might sound a bit more stringent around 10kHz.
The simple solution to this, I found, has been to taper off the right angles of the felt strips that line the grid of the drivers. Easiest way to do it is to use your fingernails and pass through between each two strips of felt a dozen times. So basically the aim is to round off the outer corners of the stiffened felt strips to reduce the "waveguide" effect (imagine reshaping the cross-section of the felt strips so that it is now a half-circle instead of a rectangle).
Of course some of you might not note these differences, but I tend to be extremely picky about sound signatures, especially minor changes in sound signatures, as they bug me a lot as soon as I notice them. So just take the above with a grain of salt and only try it if the situation fits yours and you yourself experienced a similar phenomenon.
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I'm looking at the magnet plate as a diffraction effect. Maybe I'm off the ball, but I dunno...
You've got a (in theory) planar wavefront from the driver, which then passes through the magnet plate and essentially becomes a multipoint (multi-line?) array. It's no longer a planar front, so you have a diffraction pattern. Variables: size, thickness, and spacing of the holes/slits.
If I may veer tangentially into fluid dynamics, the edge of the holes plays a role in "flow" (assuming we're going for laminar flow instead of turbulent). Whether or not that's applicable to acoustics since we're dealing with energy propagation not bulk flow, I dunno, but I wonder what properties transfer over.
Or maybe this all does have some effect, but the magnitude is inconsequential compared to the reflections/resonances/etc.
Eh, too much thinking and blathering.
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I'm looking at the magnet plate as a diffraction effect. Maybe I'm off the ball, but I dunno...
You've got a (in theory) planar wavefront from the driver, which then passes through the magnet plate and essentially becomes a multipoint (multi-line?) array. It's no longer a planar front, so you have a diffraction pattern. Variables: size, thickness, and spacing of the holes/slits.
If I may veer tangentially into fluid dynamics, the edge of the holes plays a role in "flow" (assuming we're going for laminar flow instead of turbulent). Whether or not that's applicable to acoustics since we're dealing with energy propagation not bulk flow, I dunno, but I wonder what properties transfer over.
Or maybe this all does have some effect, but the magnitude is inconsequential compared to the reflections/resonances/etc.
Eh, too much thinking and blathering.
My thinking is simple. Sound waves get emitted from the diaphragm membrane, hits the face of the listener, gets partially reflected back, then bounces off the flat metal array and to the face/ears again. Covering all that with felt is an attempt to reduce that, and it seems to be a perceptible difference in clarity.
Edit: oh you are discussing about my observation about the "waveguiding". Nvm. But yeah tapering off the felt seems to do the trick, so maybe it does have something to do with the soundwave behaviour when exiting the magnet arrays (and in this case felt layers).
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hehe Laminar vs turbulent flow. We engineers think alike.
I'm also curious about the need to taper the felt. I would say that cutting the felt to match the zig-zag pattern that's on the grill would be very helpful. A straight cut should have slight obstruction to waves coming off the driver.
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hehe Laminar vs turbulent flow. We engineers think alike.
I'm also curious about the need to taper the felt. I would say that cutting the felt to match the zig-zag pattern that's on the grill would be very helpful. A straight cut should have slight obstruction to waves coming off the driver.
You don't think the smooth straight sides of the magnets themselves will be the predominant "guide" for the soundwaves? The thickness of the metal array plate seems negligible compared to how thick the magnet bars are.
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Okay I just added some strips of acoustic foam to the front of the driver on my HE-6. Not my cleanest work but I figure it shouldn't matter too much. Don't have time for in-depth impressions at the moment, but my first reaction was a more cavernous feeling bass.
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Looking at this diagram: (http://www.physicsclassroom.com/class/light/u12l1a5.gif)
We want to prevent the waves from crossing which would create an interference pattern. Yes, the grill already causes it but we want to add to that with the felt. The end effects might be trivial in the end and it makes it a lot more difficult to cut too.
I hope this makes sense.
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Probably more representative to look at slits rather than diffraction around an object...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diffraction
(ugh it's been a while since I've looked at this stuff... Dammit Jim, I'm a rocket scientist not a physicist!)
So on my thoughts earlier... is it possible to recreate a planar wavefront after the wave has passed through the magnet plate? that's sort of why I veered into thinking about laminar flow, but I'm not sure if that applies to wave physics... :-S
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In this case it's more a matter of the (lack of) curvature of the opening walls, rather than the width of the openings, that seems to be the critical factor. I've listened for a few hours now and am quite sure now that tapering the edges of the foam strips really restores the treble smoothness relative to untapered felt strips with rectangular cross-section.
Maybe high frequency sound waves are very sensitive to the conformation of the openings, and so directing them straight, without much leeway to fan out, causes them to be higher in amplitude at the ear?
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Higher frequency waves would not be as wide. As you provide a bit more space, you let a lot more through. Seems to make sense.
I'll need to find time to go to a Michael's for that felt. Do you know if they have 3M double sided adhesive? My pads are stuck directly to the housing of mine and I only have 1 more set of adhesive rings from Audeze...
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Higher frequency waves would not be as wide. As you provide a bit more space, you let a lot more through. Seems to make sense.
I'll need to find time to go to a Michael's for that felt. Do you know if they have 3M double sided adhesive? My pads are stuck directly to the housing of mine and I only have 1 more set of adhesive rings from Audeze...
Whether or not the edges of the felt cutouts are tapered does not affect the width of the driver slit openings, that's an important distinction to make. The opening width is still limited by the magnet array.
If Michaels doesn't have double-sided tape, then a hardware store like Home Depot should.
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I know high frequencies diffract less than lower frequencies...
Waves do behave differently around curved surfaces rather than sharp corners. Speaker horns are designed in a specific shape to guide the wavefront right?
So maybe the tapered foam is the closest we can get to re-establishing a planar front?
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Back to impressions with my foam strips on the HE-6... Bass definitely feels more spacious and perhaps rumbles longer. Feels like 40Hz is slightly boosted. Hard to say what's changed in the midrange but it feels like the soundstage has improved, but only with certain songs. I don't think there's any change in the upper registers, but I have damping in front of my drivers already. I have a felt disk and a tiny bit of twaron filler under my pads.
Favourite testing song at the moment: Way Down Deep - Jennifer Warnes
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I just realized that outer ring of felt is the stock felt... I thought I had to cut a damn ring of felt! /facepalm
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Back to impressions with my foam strips on the HE-6... Bass definitely feels more spacious and perhaps rumbles longer. Feels like 40Hz is slightly boosted. Hard to say what's changed in the midrange but it feels like the soundstage has improved, but only with certain songs. I don't think there's any change in the upper registers, but I have damping in front of my drivers already. I have a felt disk and a tiny bit of twaron filler under my pads.
Favourite testing song at the moment: Way Down Deep - Jennifer Warnes
Why would you bother with the backwave mod if you already have a felt disk inside the pad? That disk is already dampening the backwaves, or at least that's how I understand it.
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Because it doesn't hurt to try. I already had the material and it only took about ten minutes to cut and install the strips.
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Because it doesn't hurt to try. I already had the material and it only took about ten minutes to cut and install the strips.
You could also experiment with just having the felt backwave diffusion mod, and no felt disc.
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I could have... but I am most familiar with the sound of my HE-6 with the felt disk. I didn't want to do a big change followed by a small one. Figured I'd just do the incremental step, even though it's not exactly applicable to everyone else. Besides, I used an acoustic foam and most others will likely use felt so that's different anyways.
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Can the metal plate be easily removed? Just wondering since I don't necessarily trust the adhesive on a lot of those adhesive foam/felt materials. A lot of the time you'll end up transferring the residue and making quite a big mess. Not a problem if the plate can be removed and cleaned. Hurray for ultra sonic cleaners.
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Can the metal plate be easily removed? Just wondering since I don't necessarily trust the adhesive on a lot of those adhesive foam/felt materials. A lot of the time you'll end up transferring the residue and making quite a big mess. Not a problem if the plate can be removed and cleaned. Hurray for ultra sonic cleaners.
...No, the metal plates are permanent parts of the driver assembly, you can't take em apart unless you want to completely brick the drivers.
Wanna see bricked HE6 drivers? Look no further than Tyll's little misadventure:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3I2lyIQDC24
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Haha! I hadn't ever watched the video, but I had read a good portion of the article. Just the way he laughs about it "don't do this at home"
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Can the metal plate be easily removed? Just wondering since I don't necessarily trust the adhesive on a lot of those adhesive foam/felt materials. A lot of the time you'll end up transferring the residue and making quite a big mess. Not a problem if the plate can be removed and cleaned. Hurray for ultra sonic cleaners.
As far as Creatology sticky felt goes, it withstood the rather rigorous action doing the rounding/smoothing that jerg described (I did it more than a dozen times for each gap; 20-30 passes, I'd say). I didn't use my fingernail, but the smooth, rounded end of a small USB stick. None of the felt came unstuck in the least.
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The spacers I used for the vent on my jerg pads worked flawlessly for a couple weeks before the adhesive started smearing, much like the effect of having electrical tape heated up. If I decide to do this mod, I would really appreciate some future feedback from all you brave souls!
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Does the Creatology sticky felt leave residue when removing?
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Does the Creatology sticky felt leave residue when removing?
Not if you do it carefully, at least if you are removing them in the short term. In the long term I dunno.
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Does the Creatology sticky felt leave residue when removing?
My guess is most likely.
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Looks like I better buy a bottle of acetone then...
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One trick I use is to stick the Creatology foam on my shirt and peel it off about four or five times. It makes the adhesive less effective.
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One trick I use is to stick the Creatology foam on my shirt and peel it off about four or five times. It makes the adhesive less effective.
But then you might risk the adhesive failing in the long term if you opt the mod to be permanent.
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Na, that takes about 7-8 successive stick and peels. 4 is about right for clean metal surfaces. 3 isn't quite enough.
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I used the stiffen felt on one channel of my HE-6. I notice the bass being tighter and the vocals have "shifted" over to that side of my head meaning it brought the mids forward too. But at the same time, it sounds a bit congested. The treble is overly tame which also makes the airiness lessened too. I want to say it kinda has that LCD sound to it. *cringe*
I think I will use try using the regular felt to see if I can only bring the mids forward. Or maybe I'll leave the center of the grill alone and only apply felt to the outer edges that are blocked from underneath.
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After more painstaking cutting, I ended up with this:
(http://i.imgur.com/ViabE7Rl.jpg)
This itself tamed the treble a lot, but did forward the mids a bit. It did tighten everything overall though by a bit.
Looks like the sweet spot is going to be a mix between this and the stock settings.
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I used the stiffen felt on one channel of my HE-6. I notice the bass being tighter and the vocals have "shifted" over to that side of my head meaning it brought the mids forward too. But at the same time, it sounds a bit congested. The treble is overly tame which also makes the airiness lessened too. I want to say it kinda has that LCD sound to it. *cringe*
I think I will use try using the regular felt to see if I can only bring the mids forward. Or maybe I'll leave the center of the grill alone and only apply felt to the outer edges that are blocked from underneath.
If you read a few pages back, I noted that there seems to be some weird "waveguiding" effect with the stiff felt that made things sound a bit wonky.
http://www.changstar.com/index.php/topic,1154.msg33419.html#msg33419
Maybe that's what you experienced also.
I don't know about HE6, but my HE500s benefited in terms of airiness and clarity with the full felt application over the whole driver.
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I'll do a full felt application then... At least it's a lot less work than cutting the rounded portion. I'm also thinking about trimming the width to prevent as much waveguiding as possible.
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I'll do a full felt application then... At least it's a lot less work than cutting the rounded portion. I'm also thinking about trimming the width to prevent as much waveguiding as possible.
You should try and find a relatively thick pen, and use its butt to shape the foam strips (after they have been applied onto the drivers of course) so you taper out their 90 degree edges. I don't find the need of restricting the width necessary, by doing this. Just cut the strips so that their width correspond perfectly to the width of the magnets (about 4mm I think).
Brief MSpaint to show what I mean:
(http://i.imgur.com/LVr93oa.jpg)
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Finished covering the whole driver. Doesn't sound wonky, but the results are very similar from what I had before: slightly forwarded mids, but big loss in treble. It makes the presentation more intimate like I was using the stock velours, except the highs aren't there. Shifted the sound of the HE-6 more towards an LCD.
I think I'll go back to stock or a compromise of something in between. I really like the airiness and sparkle at the top.
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OT: but why does typing ("+" 1) say "I hate everything about you and your stupid face"?
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LOL, word/phase rephraser script. There are certain HF mannerisms which are discouraged here. This particularly one was not of my doing. Actually very little of this stuff is of my doing. But I do approve.
:)p13
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Changstar "Easter Eggs" = awesome.
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Don't take any of this stuff too seriously. We have an odd sense of humor here which can really piss certain people off:
http://www.changstar.com/index.php/topic,953.msg24229.html#msg24229 (http://www.changstar.com/index.php/topic,953.msg24229.html#msg24229)
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Don't take any of this stuff too seriously. We have an odd sense of humor here which can really piss certain people off:
http://www.changstar.com/index.php/topic,953.msg24229.html#msg24229 (http://www.changstar.com/index.php/topic,953.msg24229.html#msg24229)
:)p13
That's gold!
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I'm assuming the non-stiff adhesive felt is not as prone to this issue, yes?
BTW, trying to cut that felt was a real PITA. Even with a fresh x-acto knife, it would mostly just cut the paper backing and slide the felt around, even though I'd still be cleanly cutting the board underneath it all. My results are not the, uh, cleanest looking, but it works well enough. Couple that with my torn-up alpha pads (still trying to decide exactly how I feel about them) and my missing HE-500 grill, and the headphones look like something I put together using parts from an abandoned factory. My jergpads don't look a whole lot better given how the velour overlay is losing it's temporary adhesion to the pleather pads.
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I'm assuming the non-stiff adhesive felt is not as prone to this issue, yes?
BTW, trying to cut that felt was a real PITA. Even with a fresh x-acto knife, it would mostly just cut the paper backing and slide the felt around, even though I'd still be cleanly cutting the board underneath it all. My results are not the, uh, cleanest looking, but it works well enough. Couple that with my torn-up alpha pads (still trying to decide exactly how I feel about them) and my missing HE-500 grill, and the headphones look like something I put together using parts from an abandoned factory. My jergpads don't look a whole lot better given how the velour overlay is losing it's temporary adhesion to the pleather pads.
It's thinner, and a little harder to cut, as you discovered, and the thicker, stiffer felt should absorb more backwaves. I used the thinner felt for the cosmetic mod on the outer frame.
I used a pair of short-bladed Fiskar scissors (not cheap, but not just for this project), very sharp, and that made it easy to cut both types with precision. They're also good at trimming the edges, should the initial cut be too thick or slightly uneven. It's tough dealing with 4mm-wide pieces! I never used my X-acto knife. I did draw a line on the backing, so I rarely needed to trim.
Frankenphones FTW! ;-)
Just washed my JergulorX pads for the first time. No chance to use the cans tomorrow, so they should be dry by Tuesday, at which time I'd gladly pay you for a hamburger.
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What I need is laser beams to shoot forth from my eyeballs when cutting materials.
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I used a brand new razor blade and I also had the felt slip on me. So I used some sharp scissors instead.
I think I'm going to give this mod another try since Armaegis convinced me to take the grill off my HE-6. Yup, I never tried before today! I might keep the stock grill but just keep the foam and cotton off. Lining the driver with felt and not using the back foam and cotton should even each other out in airiness and congestedness.
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Removing the cotton and foam and using felt works!!!
Doesn't change the tonal balance much from how it originally is. I think the soundstage increased a tiny bit and forwarded the mids. I want to say things sound crisper, more snappy. Most importantly, it didn't take away the wonderful treble!
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A bit off-topic but since you guys are discussing the HE-6 and pads; has anyone else tried HM5 pads with the HE6? I found it lessened the treble edginess, but it seems to do away with the treble sparkle that's characteristic of the HE6. It also widens the soundstage a little bit, probably because of the greater distance from the ears. I was wondering if anyone can offer up a few impressions compared to the mods you're working on at the moment.
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Purrin, I take it that the measurements for the modded he-500s are from the loaner unit you have out? My listening impressions seem to confirm what the measurements show. They're very good sounding!
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Yeah, I like them a lot... Until I put them up against the modded Abyss.
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Yeah, I like them a lot... Until I put them up against the modded Abyss.
Speaking of which did you complete the damping on the Abyss baffle plate?
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Speaking of which, are the results of your modding reflected on the measured response?
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They're definitely a step ahead of the he600s for sure, but a step or two below the hd800s. I think they sit at a really good price/performance point between the two. $400, $700, $1500. I can't speak for the unmodded he-500s though.
Will post a full comparison between the two after I have done more listening.
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Right now they're only 600!
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Oops, I didn't notice Jerg posted before myself, with very similar wording nonetheless, haha... I was referring to Purrin's modified Abyss, whether his latest mods reflect on the measured response.
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Hi Marv,
Do you have the distortion measurements of the HE-500 w/ jergpads without the vents mod?
I just got my jergpads here and the only change I'm still not sure if I liked or not is in the bass region. The bass sounds a little "wooly"(don't know how to describe it). Sounded slightly cleaner/accurate with the velours to me. I'm not so sure about it either though. Maybe it's just "expectation bias", since I've read many times before that distortion in the sub-bass is higher with the jergpads.
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Here you go.
With vents (standard jerg setup)
Without vents (jerg pads, but vents taped over)
There are measurable changes, but they are not huge. I'll go back and forth using the same recordings at same / similar volume levels to get a better subjective sense.
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Thanks, Marv. It seems that distortion is higher than with the velours even with the vents taped over.
Now I'm wondering how that would translate into a %THD graphic. Would it be higher than 1%, or the difference would be irrelevant? (sorry if this is a stupid question. Not my cup of tea...)
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Hard to say. Best that I redo all three measurements at once in one sessions. I'm not sure much the measurements say much. It's too close to call. Sometimes we do need to rely upon our ears and do our best to employ various techniques to minimize possible placebo or nocebo effects.
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Have been hearing these for a bit. I would say these are a little darker than the HD600s I have heard. They are also pretty resolving. The bass on these is fantastic and effortless. No wonkyness nor ear numbing treble issues.
These are seriously good.
They are ortho-heavy, but the pads are very comfy.
Some measurements:
Frequency Response
(http://www.changstar.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=1154.0;attach=5975;image)
CSD Right
(http://www.changstar.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=1154.0;attach=5977;image)
CSD Left
(http://www.changstar.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=1154.0;attach=5979;image)
Distortion Right
(http://www.changstar.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=1154.0;attach=5981;image)
Distortion Left
(http://www.changstar.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=1154.0;attach=5983;image)
Both CSDs and distortion seem fairly clean.
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Have been hearing these for a bit. I would say these are a little darker than the HD600s I have heard. They are also pretty resolving. The bass on these is fantastic and effortless. No wonkyness nor ear numbing treble issues.
These are seriously good.
They are ortho-heavy, but the pads are very comfy.
Some measurements:
Frequency Response
(http://www.changstar.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=1154.0;attach=5975;image)
CSD Right
(http://www.changstar.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=1154.0;attach=5977;image)
CSD Left
(http://www.changstar.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=1154.0;attach=5979;image)
Distortion Right
(http://www.changstar.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=1154.0;attach=5981;image)
Distortion Left
(http://www.changstar.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=1154.0;attach=5983;image)
Both CSDs and distortion seem fairly clean.
Thanks for the measurements! I've been looking forward to these. Looks like apart from the slightly-too-much depression around 1-2kHz, and the slight 10kHz ringing/peak, everything is dandy.
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Relative to other cans, IMO that 10kHz ringing is fairly short lived. Also, that 1-2 kHz depression seems pretty common. In this case I didn't feel like things where wonky or weird. I really like the balance on these. The price of the 500s seems pretty attractive too considering other competitive Cleveland $ range options.
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Nice work ultra! Can't wait to give these a shot :money:
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I'll bring them over at the meet :)p5
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Hey Ultrabike, I had to use your measurement FR plot as a point of discussion in a post I made on Head-fi just now, hope you won't mind. I tacked on a "(c) ultrabike 2014" before posting it.
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:)p13 no problem at all mate.
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Hi guys.
Today I ran some tests on my HE-500 with sinegen and detected an annoying "bzz" somewhere between 500hz and 600hz at really loud levels. I haven't noticed this issue in past tests, but I never performed them in this amplitude. What's bugging me is that I opened it right before to clean the drivers. Is this issue inherent to the HE-500, or I just f*cked it up?
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A buzz at specific frequencies is probably a bit of dirt or hair caught in the driver somewhere...
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But I have opened it before the tests and didn't see any dirt or hair.
I'll look again. What would be the best way to clean it?
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Basically just a felt disc, with very specific cutouts so that the open portions of the driver are still open, and the magnet/steel portions are covered (by double-sided tape). The intention is to damp away backwaves from the face when wearing the headphones. Subjectively the upper midrange gets a lot "clearer" sounding with this.
May be a bit late, but still. I did not try it for HE-500, but for some other orthos I prefer to use Blu Tack for this, instead of felt. I feel felt sacrifices some punch sometimes
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A buzz at specific frequencies is probably a bit of dirt or hair caught in the driver somewhere...
I found two strands which seemed to belong to the dust filter cloth and took out both of them with an anti-magnetic tweezer. The problem is, when I pulled the second one, the diaphragm came together. Now the issue is gone, but I have a little hole on the diaphragm. Should have never opened it :'(
Here's a photo of the hole:
(http://i249.photobucket.com/albums/gg203/OkamotoSan/IMG_0305.jpg)
Does anyone know if the hole can get larger with use?
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A buzz at specific frequencies is probably a bit of dirt or hair caught in the driver somewhere...
I found two strands which seemed to belong to the dust filter cloth and took out both of them with an anti-magnetic tweezer. The problem is, when I pulled the second one, the diaphragm came together. Now the issue is gone, but I have a little hole on the diaphragm. Should have never opened it :'(
Here's a photo of the hole:
(http://i249.photobucket.com/albums/gg203/OkamotoSan/IMG_0305.jpg)
Does anyone know if the hole can get larger with use?
Eek! You should just get that replaced by Head-direct/Hifiman at this point.
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A buzz at specific frequencies is probably a bit of dirt or hair caught in the driver somewhere...
I found two strands which seemed to belong to the dust filter cloth and took out both of them with an anti-magnetic tweezer. The problem is, when I pulled the second one, the diaphragm came together. Now the issue is gone, but I have a little hole on the diaphragm. Should have never opened it :'(
Here's a photo of the hole:
(http://i249.photobucket.com/albums/gg203/OkamotoSan/IMG_0305.jpg)
Does anyone know if the hole can get larger with use?
Eek! You should just get that replaced by Head-direct/Hifiman at this point.
Not sure if they'd offer me a replacement. But yeah, It's the only thing left to do.
The cloth strand was really from the dust filter. Looks like it still had some glue on it, that's why it was stuck to the diaphragm. Not a clue how they got there since I've never removed my HE-500s grills until now.
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A buzz at specific frequencies is probably a bit of dirt or hair caught in the driver somewhere...
I found two strands which seemed to belong to the dust filter cloth and took out both of them with an anti-magnetic tweezer. The problem is, when I pulled the second one, the diaphragm came together. Now the issue is gone, but I have a little hole on the diaphragm. Should have never opened it :'(
Here's a photo of the hole:
(http://i249.photobucket.com/albums/gg203/OkamotoSan/IMG_0305.jpg)
Does anyone know if the hole can get larger with use?
Eek! You should just get that replaced by Head-direct/Hifiman at this point.
Not sure if they'd offer me a replacement. But yeah, It's the only thing left to do.
The cloth strand was really from the dust filter. Looks like it still had some glue on it, that's why it was stuck to the diaphragm. Not a clue how they got there since I've never removed my HE-500s grills until now.
They have to offer you a replacement. The driver has a significant buzzing issue, which is caused by a fibre glued to the diaphragm membrane. Either way (buzzing driver without hole, or non-buzzing driver with a hole) it is defective.
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Just received an answer from hifiman. They're gonna replace it :)p7
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Jerg, what do you think of using cork instead of felt for damping? I've heard that cork has good acoustical properties.
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Jerg, what do you think of using cork instead of felt for damping? I've heard that cork has good acoustical properties.
You mean for the fuzzor mod? I think that on a very small scale such as with this mod, where the strips are cut to be only a few millimetres across in width, felt or very porous acoustic foam are the best bet. Cork-like material may be more effective on a macroscopic scale.
Also, an issue I encountered was that it was very easy for the fuzzor mod to negatively interfere with the initial sound waves passing through the slits between the magnets, which introduced issues in the upper mids / treble region. To strictly absorb the backwaves and do nothing more, felt strips with rounded-off edges was the compromise that made the most sense to me.
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Guys, I just received my replacement from HiFiMAN. I started testing it with some music and everything seemed ok. Then I decided to do the sinegen test again, just to make sure the "bzz" arround 500hz has disappeared. For my surprise, it's still there. I'm starting to think this is inherent to the headphone. I did the tests with a Xonar DG because my main rig is at loan. Do you think this "bzz" I'm hearing is being caused by the source/amp? Or maybe it's some kind of artifact introduced by sinegen? I only hear this when I put the Level at 0dB.
EDIT. Guys, looks like this time it's really being caused either by amplification or sinegen itself, because it happens with all my headphones(except HD800, because the cable was loaned too lol) in all frequencies at 0.5~0.0dB. Sorry for posting before doing further experiments.
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Are you running just a plain sine at 500Hz? What volume approx? You don't happen to be feeding an O2 amp?
EDIT (based on your edit and better reading comprehension on my part):
Some equipment tends to clip at 0db. Seriously.
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lip at 0db. Seriously.
Yeah, looks like it's either the Xonar DG or an artifact introduced by sinegen. Only way to really know if the issue is gone is when I have my rig back.
Oh, and by the way, on another topic, I just removed the HE-500 pads to check if they sent the jergpads back(I forgot to remove it when I sent my old HE-500 and asked them to ship it back with the replacement unit) and noticed something was different. I think they sent me one of the new pads developed for the HE-560 or HE-400i. Anyone who has these two can confirm it to me? Pic below(velours on top and the supposedly HE-560 pads below):
(http://i57.tinypic.com/2dh8uvt.jpg)
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lip at 0db. Seriously.
Yeah, looks like it's either the Xonar DG or an artifact introduced by sinegen. Only way to really know if the issue is gone is when I have my rig back.
Oh, and by the way, on another topic, I just removed the HE-500 pads to check if they sent the jergpads back(I forgot to remove it when I sent my old HE-500 and asked them to ship it back with the replacement unit) and noticed something was different. I think they sent me one of the new pads developed for the HE-560 or HE-400i. Anyone who has these two can confirm it to me? Pic below(velours on top and the supposedly HE-560 pads below):
(http://i57.tinypic.com/2dh8uvt.jpg)
No, looking at how far the bottom flaps go over the mounting ring, that's a regular old earpad.
But the bottom mounting ring is definitely what's used in the hybrid pads (with its extra-large openings).
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Thanks for confirming, jerg. Guess I'll have to live with it then.
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Jerg,
Wanted to know your opinion if it would be good if I upgrade my current pads to HE560 pads for my HE500?
Is it significant enough and $ well spent?
If it can improve my HE-500 with the new pads it might cure my itch for a while more..
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Jerg,
Wanted to know your opinion if it would be good if I upgrade my current pads to HE560 pads for my HE500?
Is it significant enough and $ well spent?
If it can improve my HE-500 with the new pads it might cure my itch for a while more..
The new pads would be a comfort improvement and (for the most part) bass improvement, but mids and treble I still think jergpads tune HE500s in a nicer fashion.