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Author Topic: Frogbeats C4 IEM Measurements  (Read 11764 times)

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tomscy2000

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Re: Frogbeats C4 IEM Measurements
« Reply #20 on: November 15, 2012, 07:19:08 PM »

Yes, the 4.A has gotten good reviews on HF, but shouldn't the detail be very similar for earphones that have the same basic armatures? I'm thinking choice of acoustic filters plays a role as well.

I can confirm from the pictures that the damper filtering the DTEC is the same red 2200 ohm damper as the one used in the 4.A. I can't be sure as to the damper choice in front of the TWFK, because it's possible that it's grey (330 ohm), white (680 ohm), or even green (1680 ohm) as the shell is green so I can't tell. I'm willing to make an educated guess that it's white, though.

Regarding detail, I think it's less about the articulation of the drivers themselves and more about the crossover enabling linear phase response and a frequency response that enables transparent sound. A more advanced driver would definitely change the sound, but judging from the notch recorded and the relative levels of the peak amplitudes, I still say they look similar.

It'd be nice to see a CSD plot of the C4, and hopefully the 4.Ai as well. That'd give us a good idea of how close together the two are, though variances will happen because of the universal tip vs. custom sound bore, etc.
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Marvey

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Re: Frogbeats C4 IEM Measurements
« Reply #21 on: November 16, 2012, 04:10:40 AM »

Burst decays (sort of like CSDs, but in cycles instead of milliseconds). I prefer to use burst decays instead of CSDs for IEMs.

Little bit of ringing at 3k, but I think his behavior adds a little bit to the edge and clarity of the C4. It actually works well with the slightly rising mid-bass response. It should be noted that overall behavior is still quite excellent.
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Marvey

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Heir 4ai IEM Measurements
« Reply #22 on: November 16, 2012, 04:31:40 AM »

Heir 4ai for comparison
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tomscy2000

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Re: Frogbeats C4 IEM Measurements
« Reply #23 on: November 16, 2012, 05:06:29 AM »

I've noticed quite a few BA IEMs tend to ring around 3k -- something about mechanical compression of the diaphragm, I dunno.

Wow, that US-tour 4.Ai does have pretty terrible L/R matching... but like I said, with the exception of probable variances in the upper frequencies due to tip variance vs. custom bore, the C4 and 4.Ai match up fairly similarly... expected for two IEMs that use the same drivers and are tuned for the same type of sound. I'm willing to bet if a 4.A were measured on the same rig, it'd look even more similar to the C4.
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Marvey

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Re: Frogbeats C4 IEM Measurements
« Reply #24 on: November 16, 2012, 05:11:56 AM »

Actually they were measured on the same rig. I took both measurements on the same day I think. Just sat on them for a variety of reasons. They did sound very different though. The 4ai sounded more rolled-off and uneven in the mids in comparison to the C4. I'll let Anax comment on it since I didn't take any notes.
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tomscy2000

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Re: Frogbeats C4 IEM Measurements
« Reply #25 on: November 16, 2012, 05:28:14 AM »

Oh, I meant a 4.A, not 4.Ai... meaning if the sound bore was also a custom acrylic tip.

Yeah, FR isn't the whole story when it comes to sound, but it does confirm that the C4 and 4.A/Ai are using extremely similar drivers (not unexpected).
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Marvey

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Re: Frogbeats C4 IEM Measurements
« Reply #26 on: November 16, 2012, 05:33:07 AM »

Ahh!. Yeah, this is all very interesting. I'm glad you pointed the the specific characteristics of the TWFK and how that dip varies according to how the bass driver is crossed over. I wish I could take measurements independent of the crossover...
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Anaxilus.

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Re: Frogbeats C4 IEM Measurements
« Reply #27 on: November 16, 2012, 05:44:10 AM »

It seems like the channel differences could be a significant contributing factor to the weirdness in the mids.  Clearly the C4 implements it's drivers and crossover much better.  Seems the immediate behavior of the C4 before and after the narrow 3.25k-4k dip provides a much more favorable, neutral sound to my ears compared to the 4ai.  I presume the right channel is not working as intended accounting for the perceived weirdness from 1khz-3khz.

I had contemplated confronting Heir about the loaner unit as I did the UM Merlin demo but decided to just pass it on and see what others heard.  I figured they would have measured them before sending out a loaner unit....
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CEE TEE

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Re: Frogbeats C4 IEM Measurements
« Reply #28 on: November 21, 2012, 10:01:32 AM »

Ah, is that wha' happen'd to the UM Merlin Demo?   facepalm
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Marvey

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Re: Frogbeats C4 IEM Measurements
« Reply #29 on: December 18, 2012, 05:33:31 AM »

Frogbeats HD. Typical BA distortion measurement.
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