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Author Topic: Oppo PM-2  (Read 12047 times)

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Anaxilus

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Re: Oppo PM-2
« Reply #60 on: October 11, 2014, 04:16:10 AM »

It's a typical planar lack of midbass.  Although the Oppos sound even more midbass light than some other planars.  All you hear is extension, no ballz.  Plus they have no punch or upper bass impact making it even more boring in the low end.  Zero slam, bumpity or punch. /yawn
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Colgin

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Re: Oppo PM-2
« Reply #61 on: November 12, 2014, 04:27:25 AM »

Now that I have passed along the Oppo PM-2 in the loaner program to the next person on the list, I thought I should finally get around to giving some brief impressions.  The PM-2 had been on my serious consideration list for purchase, so the loaner was very helpful in making an actual decision as opposed to just being a "it would be nice to hear these" exercise.

I am told that the cans in the loaner program have the PM-1 Alt pads, rather than the stock PM-2 pads. When the Oppos arrived, I unfortunately did not have access to my  Marantz amp in the living room. So, I just plugged them into my Iphone in my bedroom and started running through my test tracks which consists mostly of rock (classic and "alternative"), jazz and other instrumental, but not too much electronica or classical. Ordinarily I would not pass any judgment on a headphone at this price point based on how it runs off of a portable, but since Oppo clearly markets these as being super-efficient and many at Head-Fi had claimed they heard no difference on the PM-1 amped versus unamped, it did not seem unfair to start making some initial impressions, particularly since, in my case, one of the selling points was the purported efficiency of the PM-2 (in the same way that aside from sound quality, the Audeze LCD-X has more appeal to me than the LCD-2 or LCD-3 since in a pinch you can run them off of a portable and IMO get pretty decent sound). 

Initially, I was a bit underwhelmed. At this price pint I was looking for some "wow" factor and did not hear it. Nothing sounded bad per se, but nothing stood out. A lot of other TOTL/reference cans have some aspect of their sound signature that really stand out and grab you, at least upon an initial listen -- HD800 (soundstage and detail); Stax (clarity and naturalness); Audeze (deep bass extension and impact). (The flip side of "wow" factor is that you might over time realize something is out of balance or less than neutral or gimmicky or simply fatiguing.) With the PM-2 I couldn't find any particular faults, but I also initially could not find anything notable or exemplary.  The soundstage had been so downplayed in what I had read and my expectations so lowered that I was somewhat pleasantly surprised that it was pretty decent and I absolutely feel that they sound like open cans and not closed as I have read elsewhere; just not the most open sounding cans. The bass extension was excellent but I felt it was lacking punch or slam (I always get those two confused, but there was not the sense of impact that I get from a well-amped Audeze). Given that the PM-2 seemed technically quite competent to me, I could not figure out why they seemed a little boring. Then some phrases from this site came to mind "lacking ballz" and "limp-dicked" or something to that effect. And I thought to myself, they are lacking "ballz" a bit if you will. Of course, it didn't help that I was also doing compare and contrast at that time with my treble-happy AKG and Grados there instead of just listening to music and trying to evaluate the PM-2 on its own for what it is.

The first day or so I was pretty disappointed since I wanted to like the PM-2 so much as they hit all the other marks for me in terms of looks, comfort (simply one of the most comfortable headphones I have ever worn notwithstanding that they are still significantly heavier than my AKG or a Senn HD600/650, for example).  But I decided to take some more time with the PM-2 and just listen to albums and not run test tracks and do quick comparisons with other phones. And I found that I started really enjoying their sound. I still thought they could be a bit "soft", but I started enjoying their virtues -- they are reasonably detailed, it is just less apparent than on a treble-happy can; the bass extension obviously kills my AKG and IMO cans like the 600/650; signature is completely non-fatiguing; soundstage is good and realistic if not terribly wide; the timbre of instruments seemed really correct and natural to me.  For example, I realized I loved the sound of drums on the PM-2. Yes, the Audeze had more impact, but to me the PM-2 presentation sounded much more like real drums. The best part is that I could get this good sound without being near my main rig, which necessitated running a long cable from my living room couch to my amp on the other side of the room. I could get it out of an Ipad or an Iphone in my bedroom and not need anything else.  I could also walk around my apartment with this comfortably on my head or lounge on my side while reading the paper or my tablet. In contrast, I doubt I could do that with an Audeze. I am also really lazy. Even unpacking my AKG Q701 from its giant Casebuddi XXL case and attaching the 20 foot cable is sometimes too much work for me when I am tired and it is nearing midnight. And just not worth the effort to set up if I can only catch just 15-20 minutes of music before bedtime. But the ease of use of the Oppo meant that I found myself listening to them pretty much every night. I could set up and get good sound so quickly that there was never an excuse not to. If I was too lazy to set up my AKGs many a night, I suspect it would be even worse with something like a super-heavy Audeze. I know these factors may be completely inapplicable to many here, but they meant a lot to me.

While I did do a lot of listening simply through my phone, I also did finally spend some time using my amp. My humble Marantz integrated is decent but surely cannot compete with the likes of the amps typically discussed here. But I did find that while the PM-2 did not scale massively, the punch in the bass that I thought was lacking and perhaps making the PM-2s a bit boring at times, was there quite a bit more when driven by an amp. It may not have had quite the punch of an Audeze, but amping the PM-2, while not necessarily taking them to reference level, definitely improved them in the bass department and to some extent in terms of soundstage as well. Overall, I no longer felt that these were boring (limp-dicked/lacking ballz) when amped, although they still maintained there overall laid-back sound signature.

Tyll has referred to the PM-1/PM-2 as quality lifestyle phones, but not reference level. OJNeg has a great description here which I think is along the same lines in that they consistently give good sound without a lot of fuss needed.  These types of descriptions were kind of turn offs for me. In my mind, I had been looking for more of a reference level sound and was hoping the PM-2 could perhaps provide that, but in a friendlier package. However, I realized that maybe these other factors were ultimately more important to me than achieving reference level sound (whatever that means), so long as I did, in fact. think the sound was very good. And ultimately that is the conclusion I came to. The PM-2 with PM-1 alt pads had very good sound, but not necessarily reference level, and were really easy to get along with. Before passing them along, I did get to a dealer to give one last listen to the LCD-2 and LCD-X with some of my music. I felt that both Audezes were probably a bit better than the PM-2, but not miles better when the PM-2 was amped (as opposed to unamped where it could sound too soft, whereas to me the LCD-X does not sound soft off of even my phone, just less refined in all respects). Moreover, I realized that the Audezes were just too painful given that they clamp on my TMJ and I suffer from TMJ pain. I have always gotten along OK with Audezes but never really listened to them for more than 10 minutes at a time. I strongly suspect that if I had bought them I could maybe suffer through 30 minutes before they became too uncomfortable. I believe that I could wear the PM-2 for hours at a time (not that I ever really listen to cans for such long periods).

I also considered the HD600 or 650 as cheaper alternatives. I actually find the PM-2 more comfortable than the 600/650, but it is close. IME, while the 600/650 can be driven off of portables, they are not nearly their best and really need/deserve to be amped. I really do like the ability to be able to drive the PM-2 off my phone, although I do intend to use an amp whenever possible. Also, I think the low bass quality is better on the PM-2 than the Senns. While, the PM-2 loses on soundstage to both Senns, I don't mind that tradeoff, particularly since I have my Q701 for when soundstage is important (when I am in the mood for classical, for exampe, those are what I will go to).

As my loaner period drew to a close I already found myself missing the PM-2. So, as soon as I shipped to Thujone I went to the Oppo site and ordered a pair, which should be here tomorrow or Thursday. I did not order the PM-1 Alt pads.  I figured I would see how I liked the stock pads, and to the extent that they are lacking either sonically or in terms of comfort I will then order the PM-1 Alt pads.  Whether the PM-2 is the right can for someone I think will depend a lot on how important some of these "lifestyle" factors are compared to just getting the best sound for the money or the best sound regardless of cost. For me, they are an overall very attractive package. And I do believe they are a very good sounding can without any glaring faults.

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jexby

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Re: Oppo PM-2
« Reply #62 on: November 12, 2014, 05:51:22 AM »

Colgin,

so no interest or patience for 60 days and waiting out for the PM-3 to perhaps save some coin and hear different voicing?
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Colgin

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Re: Oppo PM-2
« Reply #63 on: November 12, 2014, 04:01:12 PM »

Colgin,

so no interest or patience for 60 days and waiting out for the PM-3 to perhaps save some coin and hear different voicing?


No, not really. I would love to hear the PM-3 when they come out and I hope they are good. But for home use I am only interested in open headphones. If I were open to closed cans I would have already bought some iteration of Mr. Speakers' Mad Dogs or Alpha Dogs by now as I like them. (In fact I would buy the ADs over the Audeze LCD-XC, price aside.)  But I just vastly prefer open cans and only buy closed cans for portable.

As for portables, I am extremely happy with my V-Moda M-80. It handles everything I throw at it very well. I have tried almost all of the newer portables, including the ones touted as surpassing the V-Moda, but to my taste I still like the V-Moda the best. It is possible that the PM-3 will just knock it out of the park in terms of portables and then I suppose I would consider it as an upgrade to my V-Moda. However, the V-Moda are pretty indestructible and I use the with some degree of recklessness and they have held up amazingly well. I tend to think I would not be able to do the same with the PM-3 but that remains to be seen.
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Garry

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Re: Oppo PM-2
« Reply #64 on: November 12, 2014, 06:48:15 PM »

Hi Colgin

Thanks for your impressions and perspective which I think brings up some really interesting points regarding how and when we use equipment.
I realise after many years that convenience can play an important part in how often and when we use equipment. I now find I am using my Cowon X7 and Etymotic ER4S more often than my main setup even though in sound quality terms it isn't as good, this is down to listening more when in bed and sat in the conservatory. I accept that this isn't the case for everyone.
Now realise I need a DAP with improved sound quality but still with equalizer as per Cowon.
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Garry

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Re: Oppo PM-2
« Reply #65 on: November 12, 2014, 09:30:39 PM »

IME, the OPPO planars have a lot of potential but are held back by their enclosure and damping scheme. Even basic mod changes seem to bring them to life, primarily by boosting the bass and, to a smaller extent, the treble.

I prefer the velour pads by far on the OPPO planars, but you may disagree. They certainly work best on my PM-2 mods...
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Colgin

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Re: Oppo PM-2
« Reply #66 on: November 13, 2014, 08:48:56 PM »

So, Fed Ex showed up a day early with my PM-2 yesterday. In retrospect I should have ordered these before I had to send along the loaner pair so I could compare and contrast the stock pads with the PM-1 Alt Pads. At least on certain tracks (such as from the latest Arctic Monkeys album AM), the treble did seem a little more harsh or strident, but not necessarily brighter, than what I recall from the PM-2 with the PM-1 Alt Pads. But this could have been just expectation bias as I had been expecting that as a possibility based on what I read from others. On some jazz recordings I listened to and on some early albums by The Band, I did not notice any real differences from my memory of the same on the loaner pair. But I would say any difference is still pretty subtle, but may be there.  Comfort on the stock pads are pretty good, but you can tell they are not real leather. I am not particularly a leather fan, but I would say the Alt 1 pads were marginally more comfortable than the stock PM-2.

At $30 I would have probably bought the Alt pads right out of the gate to have consistency with what I had been listening to before. At almost $60 I thought I should give stock pads a chance for a few days to a week.  Would love to give the original leathers a try as Tyll said those were his favorite on the PM-2, but at $60 a pop (and non-returnable) I am not going to buy a bunch to experiment, particularly because I doubt I would pad-roll based on musical choices, but rather would just settle on my overall favorite. 

Anyway, I was happy these arrived although with all the talk of the AKG K7xx part of me kind of wished I waited until those dropped. I suspect they will be at a price point that I may just trade up from my Q701 if there is enough of an improvement as the PM-2 is not going to replace my use of the Q701 but rather complement it (time will tell which I end up using more).

Also, I would be interested in any recommendations for amps that would go well with the PM-2 but that should also play nice with the AKG. Interested in suggestions under $500 and then between $500 - $1,000.  Above that is probably not happening right now, although the rRag is very tempting as I can use it as a speaker amp as well and thus justify the greater expenditure.
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Hands

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Re: Oppo PM-2
« Reply #67 on: November 13, 2014, 09:22:09 PM »

Yeah, what measurements I've seen and thoughts I've read regarding pad differences makes me think the stock PM-2 pads are probably the weakest ones out of the bunch. Hopefully you can get your hands on some velour ones to try as well at some point.
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Colgin

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Re: Oppo PM-2
« Reply #68 on: November 13, 2014, 09:36:05 PM »

Yeah, what measurements I've seen and thoughts I've read regarding pad differences makes me think the stock PM-2 pads are probably the weakest ones out of the bunch. Hopefully you can get your hands on some velour ones to try as well at some point.

The velour ones are cheaper; I think like $30. So, maybe if I end up getting the leather Alt pads I will just throw in another $30 to have the velours as well. But I cannot see spending for two sets of leather pads.
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