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Author Topic: Neutrality  (Read 11728 times)

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Sphinxvc

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Re: Neutrality
« Reply #50 on: December 02, 2012, 10:41:39 PM »

Fuck yeah.

Wait, it's unclear, which part is BS, that "anatomy affects the way you perceive sound", or that some claim to be able to 'compensate' for it? 

In full disclosure, I know nothing about this subject, so I'm definitely not trolling for dialogue, I'm just trying to read what's already written here accurately, and what's here is ambiguous. 

Oh and, I find it amusing how F-bombs are thrown around fucking willy nilly.
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jerg

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Re: Neutrality
« Reply #51 on: December 02, 2012, 10:44:04 PM »

It comes down to how much variance there is between individuals in the populace. If the variance is fairly high (disregarding outliers of course) then yeah something that is perceived as neutral by one person's hearing could potentially sound wonky by another person's, even if both have healthy hearing. If it is low then most people will hear similar things, and neutral would be accounted for as truly neutral.
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thefoundMIDrange

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Re: Neutrality
« Reply #52 on: December 02, 2012, 10:48:01 PM »

Nothing wrong with a little heated give and take.
I love to watch a good cockfight, but i won't join in. I like to remain neutral.
I was sitting in my rx7 today and the effin thing wouldn't get me to that special place I wanted. Then I realized the effin thing was in neutral. I shifted through the gears and was instantly transported through space. Frickin miracle.

neu·tral [noo-truhl

a.gray; without hue; of zero chroma; achromatic.

b.matching well with many or most other colors or shades, as white or beige.
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Solderdude

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Re: Neutrality
« Reply #53 on: December 02, 2012, 10:54:17 PM »

Can I be neutral on this neutrality thing ?  :P...

I'd love to... but while enjoying the thread  popcorn I think I have a preference for RD's viewpoints as they seem to match mine closest.
Oh wait... that means I am not neutral either ... F..k neutrality... it doesn't exist.. it is just perceived that way.  :-Z

I think the OP says it all though and should not be up for discussion.
I believe that was his point all along.

Flat is flat and that is that (assuming ringing and distortion are low as well)
« Last Edit: December 02, 2012, 11:01:08 PM by Solderdude »
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Use your ears to enjoy music, not as an analyser.

thefoundMIDrange

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Re: Neutrality
« Reply #54 on: December 02, 2012, 10:57:12 PM »

.....like alot of things, general concensus over time seems to be how things work. As long as headfi forumites are not used as part of that general concensus . I trust folks here and ol joe grado over current headphone producers and those rigid and mechanical germans. them beyers and senns is cold
« Last Edit: December 02, 2012, 11:15:01 PM by thelostMIDrange »
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rhythmdevils

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Re: Neutrality
« Reply #55 on: December 02, 2012, 11:16:26 PM »

If we all hear differently, then how is my YH3 dead flat when I tuned them to sound flat with nothing but music, and flat speakers as a reference.  My parents must have surgically implanted rubber Neumann ears on my head when I was a baby.   ::)
« Last Edit: December 02, 2012, 11:22:48 PM by rhythmdevils »
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wiinippongamer

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Re: Neutrality
« Reply #56 on: December 02, 2012, 11:59:45 PM »

My parents must have surgically implanted rubber Neumann ears on my head when I was a baby.   ::)

That must be it!  :o
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rhythmdevils

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Re: Neutrality
« Reply #57 on: December 03, 2012, 12:34:29 AM »

My apologies for bringing up HRTF and dropping F bombs and then not explaining my opinion.  I'll try to at some point, a good discussion about it would be good in it's own thread.  If you want to pm me some info on why HRTF applies when the driver is close to the ear and not for real life or speakers, that would be cool.  Also would like to know if a sealed chamber around the ear creates unique hearing in all of us, then whether velour negates that since it doesn't seal.  And whether the K1000 has less HRTF issues. 
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wiinippongamer

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Re: Neutrality
« Reply #58 on: December 03, 2012, 02:52:50 AM »

Since it's on topic with the thread and might help other people I'll post it here:

Think of it kind of like a room's effect on speakers, you're the eardrum, the outer ear is the furniture and the room is enclosed by the pads and baffle, the difference is in the frequency bands that get affected since high frequency has very little space to attenuate and gets reflected back and forth inside the tiny room along with lower frequencies; while speakers are mostly affected in the bass/lower mids region. The more open/less reflective you make it the less it matters, both for hp's and speakers. 

Then there's the thing of compensation curves which are a wholly different subject and have more to do with position of the sound source.

Just to avoid confusion, you can also hear high frequency reflections with speakers in a large room, when you clap inside a church, etc. BUT the reflected wave is (almost) never higher in amplitude than the original, as is the case with headphones, so it doesn't really modify the FR in the end.

« Last Edit: December 03, 2012, 03:16:55 AM by wiinippongamer »
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donunus

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Re: Neutrality
« Reply #59 on: December 03, 2012, 07:50:27 AM »

I disagree, there is neutral.  I'll go ahead an say it- I think HRTF is fucking bullshit

HRTF is bs because there are just too many variables. Averaging doesn't seem to help much either.

I say it exists but it only matters if all other factors are also done right. It is useless to calculate HRTFs if a headphone doesn't sound fundamentally correct in the first place.
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