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Author Topic: Yggdrasil Measurements  (Read 8532 times)

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atomicbob

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Re: Yggdrasil Measurements
« Reply #10 on: May 14, 2015, 02:17:04 AM »

impressive jitter figures...
My sentiments exactly! Made my jaw drop when I measured it. Agreed about the crossover distortion inaudibility. Will be looking again at approx 400 hrs. Would have liked to catch 200 hrs but that darn career thing keeps soaking up my time such that when I do get a free moment, I'm more inclined to listen to music than measure the system.
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auditory illumination

Solderdude

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Re: Yggdrasil Measurements
« Reply #11 on: May 14, 2015, 06:40:38 AM »

Yeah really nice clock indeed .... well done mr. Moffat !

Those crossover blibs are just at -104dB and at a frequency of around 17kHz (for this test tone).
Judging from the waveform I figure it may not be possible to improve this using forward correction, perhaps using signed magnitude.

What would interest me is the differences in jitter between 'cold', 'several hours' and 'mucho hours' as well as seeing if the 'blib' gets smaller when warmed up.
After all the accuracy of most components is temperature dependent.
I don't think any other aspects/measurements will change over time, unless they are related to the 'blibs', which I think is visible in the form of the relatively high frequency 'poles' in the upper part of the spectrum.
But why scrutinise measurable thresholds that may not be that audible ? Ah yes ... because we do want to know.

If it is temp dependency of one specific component, sticking a tiny regulated heater (resistor) on it may greatly shorten the long 'wait before use/magic apppears period' .
Wouldn't it be great if you could switch it on and in 5 mins would do 'the magic' (IF caused by actual warming up of certain components)

I totally get the 'available time' thing vs curiosity.




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anetode

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Re: Yggdrasil Measurements
« Reply #12 on: May 14, 2015, 07:07:20 AM »

If it is temp dependency of one specific component, sticking a tiny regulated heater (resistor) on it may greatly shorten the long 'wait before use/magic apppears period' .
Wouldn't it be great if you could switch it on and in 5 mins would do 'the magic' (IF caused by actual warming up of certain components)

After all there are oven controlled DACs out there.
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anetode

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Re: Yggdrasil Measurements
« Reply #13 on: May 14, 2015, 08:05:00 AM »

By now, some of you probably have noted the THD+N graph may not be the lowest ever seen. Designers are often faced with trade-offs for various reasons. I believe the Schiit design team has made trade-offs that result in best auditory experience over best measurements possible on all fronts. I have a colleague who gives a "13 dB miracle" demonstration showing that SNR isn't the best predictor of auditory experience. So THD+N may not be that influencial on the final sound while jitter may have a bigger effect.

Try measuring at -3db and -6db, ladder DACs tend to higher THD as you approach 0dBFS.
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n3rdling

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Re: Yggdrasil Measurements
« Reply #14 on: May 14, 2015, 08:15:50 AM »

That's what the Lavry Gold does, among others. 
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ultrabike

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Re: Yggdrasil Measurements
« Reply #15 on: May 14, 2015, 08:37:16 AM »

I dunno about the Prism, but according to the legend, THD+N was measured at -0.1 dBFS where 0 dBFS maps to 14.76 dBu (according to the script log). This is close to 4 Vrms which matches Schiit's balanced drive specs. Atomicbomb would have to confirm...

I'm a bit puzzled about the "Soundcard Outputs" control. It seems it's using WDM Microsoft Sound Mapper. Where these drivers used?
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Solderdude

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Re: Yggdrasil Measurements
« Reply #16 on: May 14, 2015, 11:09:29 AM »

After all there are oven controlled DACs out there.


Yes, but I assume these are temp controlled clockgenerators only.
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Armaegis

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Re: Yggdrasil Measurements
« Reply #17 on: May 14, 2015, 02:11:53 PM »

Wait, there are actual oven dacs? I thought people were joking...
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Do you think there may be an acoustic leak from the jack hole? ~Tyll Hertsens

Not sure if I like stuffing one hole or both holes. Tending toward one hole since both holes seems kinda ghey ~Purrin

Solderdude

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Re: Yggdrasil Measurements
« Reply #18 on: May 14, 2015, 03:35:45 PM »

Clockgenerators with a built-in 'oven' are quite common if a stable frequency (does not mean low jitter) is needed.
They are called OCXO (Oven Controled X'tal Oscilator)
Quite costly ($ 50 to $ 400) and about 10 to 100x more stable than 'normal' XO's
Here is an example: http://www.farnell.com/datasheets/1883682.pdf

A bit overkill for a DAC

(should be in DAC guts stuff perhaps)
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Armaegis

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Re: Yggdrasil Measurements
« Reply #19 on: May 14, 2015, 04:45:02 PM »

Oh that makes more sense. I was picturing little dac saunas for a second there.
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Do you think there may be an acoustic leak from the jack hole? ~Tyll Hertsens

Not sure if I like stuffing one hole or both holes. Tending toward one hole since both holes seems kinda ghey ~Purrin
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