CHANGSTAR: Audiophile Headphone Reviews and Early 90s Style BBS

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Author Topic: CSDs for four different iterations of LCD3 - from most veiled to least veiled  (Read 7696 times)

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jerg

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Marv!


Do you have any closed measurements of a "good" LCD-3 (except for the "old style" plots I've found)?


Thx,
V

I'd very much like to see this too. The driver-only measurements are good for diagnosing the early LCD3 tension issues, but don't really contribute to the standardized CSD archive on the site.
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jeffreyfranz

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Attached are four LCD3 CSD plots in succession from least subjectively veiled to most veiled. Note the ringing on these measurements has been exaggerated. (These are open air measurements. Sealed measurements, which are more reflective of what we actually hear, results in the ringing reduced to below -25db. This phenomenon seems to be an ortho effect does not apply to dynamics.)

I don't know what can be arrived at these measurements other than the faster and clearer sounding iterations have the resonance at higher frequencies. Did you mean to say this the other way around? It looks like the best graph has resonance at lower frequencies. Am I not understanding? Thanks, JT  Could it be greater tensioning of the diaphragm? [More experiments on this later.]

The first plot was of an LCD3 which was obviously veiled. The second LCD3 also sounded quite veiled, but not as much as the first one. The last two plots were un-veiled LCD3s with one sounding just ever so slightly faster than the other.
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Elysian

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Re: CSDs for four different iterations of LCD3 - from most veiled to least veiled
« Reply #12 on: September 28, 2013, 02:24:28 AM »

These are the most inconsistent headphones I've ever owned. I've heard a couple of LCD3s up to this point and was pretty whatever about them. My personal LCD3s got the dreaded channel imbalance and by that time I had lost most interest in them.

Audeze's customer service was exemplary. They replaced both drivers and made a new graph for me.

I plugged them back in and they sound nothing like what they did before. They're considerably more forward, clear, and much more engaging now. Before, the presentation sounded a bit muffled and gave the impression of being in a big room with poor acoustics. Every other LCD3 I've heard sounded muddy and veiled. Crossing my fingers that these drivers stay good.
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shipsupt

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Re: CSDs for four different iterations of LCD3 - from most veiled to least veiled
« Reply #13 on: September 28, 2013, 09:36:36 AM »

So, are you interested in them again? 

You should quit messing around and get the Abyss.  :&


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Yeah, well, you know, that's just, like, your opinion, man.

Kunlun

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Re: CSDs for four different iterations of LCD3 - from most veiled to least veiled
« Reply #14 on: September 28, 2013, 04:38:39 PM »

This is pretty much everything great about changstar in a small thread, thanks purrin and gurubhai and everyone.
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Elysian

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Re: CSDs for four different iterations of LCD3 - from most veiled to least veiled
« Reply #15 on: September 29, 2013, 04:24:03 AM »

So, are you interested in them again? 

You should quit messing around and get the Abyss.  :&

Yeah, I like them now :) There was something to the LCD2 and LCD3s that made them not fun to listen to with fast music, but this pair is keeping up nicely, with good instrument separation and impact. I'm looking forward to hearing how these scale with the Levi.

The price on the Abyss is too much for me. The look like they belong in a case at Hot Topic. I'd love to hear them at a meet someday given all the positive impressions.

How responsive are the LCD3s to amping based on experience?

I wonder how they would pair with something like the Pinnacle to give them more laser focus.
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shipsupt

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Re: CSDs for four different iterations of LCD3 - from most veiled to least veiled
« Reply #16 on: September 29, 2013, 01:47:31 PM »

One of the benefits to the Abyss getting good reports is that it's going to drive Audeze to come up with a LCD-4 that competes because I believe they want to be known as having the best ortho.  They could come up with something really good.  I have to hope they have more in the works than just a closed LCD-2.

The down side is that they just might take the opportunity to price a new flag ship closer to the cost of the Abyss! 



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Yeah, well, you know, that's just, like, your opinion, man.

dBel84

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Re: CSDs for four different iterations of LCD3 - from most veiled to least veiled
« Reply #17 on: September 29, 2013, 03:14:21 PM »

I have always liked my LCD3 ( but they are not stock ) and have been tweaking even more and I now think they are truly excellent. I had mentioned to MF that I thought they would benefit from a pad similar to the TakeT H2 and after some initial experimenting, made a few changes to the pads to emulate the same concept. You basically break the seal at the front and lower end of the pads. I had previously used a fat drinking straw as proof of principle and finally just used a waxed thread and stitched it down. This opens up the soundstage dramatically, removes the "ear suction" effect, and tempers the bass intensity without losing the presence and layering.
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ader

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Re: CSDs for four different iterations of LCD3 - from most veiled to least veiled
« Reply #18 on: September 29, 2013, 03:37:08 PM »

^ Yeah, I actually used to break my seal with them sometimes and thought it did a lot of good.

Hey, having worked on them before, how do you think my LCD-3's inherently stacked up on a scale of veiled to "super"?  I always thought I got lucky with mine, but have never had a proper basis for comparison.
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dBel84

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Re: CSDs for four different iterations of LCD3 - from most veiled to least veiled
« Reply #19 on: September 29, 2013, 03:47:56 PM »

my ears are not as good as purrin's , I have noted more bass presence amongst the LCD3's I have heard but never thought of it in the context of veiled. The amount of bass will also be affected by driver tension but this is also dependant on pads etc. Purrin's measurements are open and thus pad effect is not present, the bass on the measurements does not track the frequency of the resonance.

but to your question, I would agree that you have a good sounding headphone. Tari's is similarly good.
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