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Author Topic: Best Amps for Sennheiser HD800  (Read 100596 times)

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dsavitsk

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Re: Best Amps for Sennheiser HD800
« Reply #570 on: September 08, 2015, 04:37:50 AM »

I just wanted to add a comment on driving the HD800s, and in fact just about any 300 Ohm Sennheiser phone -- I apologize if tis is already in the thread somewhere. Many headphones (grado, LCDs, etc) have an almost flat impedance. Consequently, as the amp's output impedance increases, the sound does not change too much except for perhaps some bloom due to low damping (which I and I think a  lot of people find to be a crude yet effective form of EQing). In the case of the Senns, not only do you perhaps get the low damping thing, but because of the changing impedance forming a voltage divider with the output impedance, you also get a pleasant bass hump.

As an example, here is a frequency response graph of the output of a Black Diamond (with a very low output impedance) driving an HD650 directly, with a small output transformer, and with an output transformer and a series resistor. The OPT was a 10K:300 stepdown, so in the case of just the OPT it is really an issue of the secondary's DC resistance. In the case with the resistor, the 2K5 resistor stepped down to being roughly like a 75R resistor (which with the DCR meant a roughly 100 Ohm impedance - close to the headphone standard of 120 Ohms).

If you replicate this but load everything with a 300R resistor instead of the phones, you get a 3 identical flat graphs.



I'll add that parafeed amps tend to have a natural bass hump, too. http://www.intactaudio.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=316

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Anaxilus

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Re: Best Amps for Sennheiser HD800
« Reply #571 on: September 08, 2015, 04:39:58 AM »

Among the amps I own, I believe the ZD Super to be the best amp for the HD 800 (with the Anax 2.0 mod). When I got my BW (three days ago) I was taken aback (pleasantly so) as to how close it was to the ZDS. I hear the ZDS as being a bit more spacious and digs a bit deeper into the bottom end by comparison. However, the BW is very very good on its own and easily the best SS amp that I have heard thus far.

That's how I hear them too.
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Anaxilus

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Re: Best Amps for Sennheiser HD800
« Reply #572 on: September 08, 2015, 04:48:57 AM »

The HD800 also has a natural bass hump. Our measurements here are done with my O2 amp. Tyll uses a SS amp as well I'm pretty sure. Both have negligible output impedance. About 92% of the tube amps (including transformer coupled) I recommend have an output impedance around 2-7 ohms.

Since we're on the subject, a subject which should probably be split off, any idea why planars like the LCDs and some Hifiman sound bassier on some amps versus others even though they have flat impedance curves?
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"If you do not change direction, you may end up where you are heading." - Lao Tzu

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gurubhai

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Re: Best Amps for Sennheiser HD800
« Reply #573 on: September 08, 2015, 06:09:03 AM »


Since we're on the subject, a subject which should probably be split off, any idea why planars like the LCDs and some Hifiman sound bassier on some amps versus others even though they have flat impedance curves?

I think its because of the fact that a lower impedance ortho receives only a fraction of power from a High output impedance amp compared to what it would get from a low output impedance amp. One has to remember that the lower frequency reproduction requires the maximum excursion from the driver and consequently would need much more power to be driven optimally in that region.
For instance, my 6AS7 OTL has an output impedance of 150 ohm and the LCD-2 sounds noticeably bass light on this amp. If I change he output tube to 6528 which lowers the output impedance to about 50ohms, the LCD2 gain that solid bottom end that they are famous for (almost comparable to Beta22 now). OTOH, my 150 ohm orthos sound the same FR wise regardless of the output tubes.
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subtle

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Re: Best Amps for Sennheiser HD800
« Reply #574 on: September 08, 2015, 03:42:51 PM »

If you want to try and snag an ECP L-2, it looks like there is one for sale on Head-Fi:

http://www.head-fi.org/t/737754/ic-ecp-l-2-production-model

Many moons ago I owned an ECP Black Diamond to accompany the HD800

I wouldn't waste too much time with this one.  It's been listed for over a year and in perpetual IC mode, which is essentially an auction and forbidden according to HF classified rules strangely enough.

I'm local to the seller and sent my first PM to him over a year ago trying to buy it.  He wants like $2000-2500 for it based on reputation alone when all other used L-2's that have sold on head-fi have all gone for $1200-1450.

Something tells me the IC will still be there in 2016.
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CEE TEE

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Re: Best Amps for Sennheiser HD800
« Reply #575 on: September 08, 2015, 04:20:40 PM »

^Bummer.  Because he has good feedback and he bought it from Radio_head which means he got a good deal on it.
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jacal01

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Re: Best Amps for Sennheiser HD800
« Reply #576 on: September 08, 2015, 10:51:52 PM »

So the Questyle or the Decware CSP2+ are the best among them?

Don't know if this is still timely, but of the various SS amps I've acquired, both the Questyle CMA800(R) and Bakoon HPA-21 play very nice with my HD800s (unmodded), as well as my LCD-2 orthos.  I understand both amps were actually developed and voiced using the HD800 as reference phones.

Somewhat abashedly (or not), I haven't yet unpacked my BW at work, both because I'm still waiting for the bimbo to pair it with, and because we still have some tradesmen roaming the building after hours finalizing the May flood damage repairs.  I've already lost a digital camera that way, so I'm somewhat still snakebit.  But I have high expectations for that amp with HD800s as well, based on poster feedback around here, altho I'm actually targeting my new Slants for my all new work desktop setup.

I also have T1s, but I've relegated them to strictly portable rig use, pursuant to retiring them after trying to pair them for some period with my old Soloist desktop amp.  But if you're interested, I can dust them off and see how they sound with the Questyle amp. 
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Thenewdude007

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Re: Best Amps for Sennheiser HD800
« Reply #577 on: September 10, 2015, 05:35:09 AM »

Don't know if this is still timely, but of the various SS amps I've acquired, both the Questyle CMA800(R) and Bakoon HPA-21 play very nice with my HD800s (unmodded), as well as my LCD-2 orthos.  I understand both amps were actually developed and voiced using the HD800 as reference phones.

I'm interested in your opinion on the Questyle & both the HD800 & LCD2.

My testing of the HD800 & LCD2 with a Bottlehead Crack & iFi Micro iDSD was nothing special so far.
HD800 severely lacked the mids & bass of the LCD2 & the LCD2 severely lacked the soundstage & vocals of the HD800.

Does the Questyle close the gap between the two in their weaknesses?

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Anaxilus

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Re: Best Amps for Sennheiser HD800
« Reply #578 on: September 10, 2015, 06:35:07 AM »

No

I also have to caution folks about the Bakoon+HD800 pairing in current mode. You'd be better off just getting a used HE500.

Looking for miracles with HD800s from basic stock Bottlehead Cracks and Questyles are serious pie in the sky hopes and dreams.

They haven't been mentioned as prime pairings for the HD800 before for a reason. All you're doing with these is trying to change tone and balance and getting nothing special from the HD800. At that point, you should just get another headphone instead.
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"If you do not change direction, you may end up where you are heading." - Lao Tzu

"The Claw is our master. The Claw chooses who will go or who will stay." - The LGM Community

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Arnotts

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Re: Best Amps for Sennheiser HD800
« Reply #579 on: September 10, 2015, 07:28:17 AM »

No

I also have to caution folks about the Bakoon+HD800 pairing in current mode. You'd be better off just getting a used HE500.

Looking for miracles with HD800s from basic stock Bottlehead Cracks and Questyles are serious pie in the sky hopes and dreams.

They haven't been mentioned as prime pairings for the HD800 before for a reason. All you're doing with these is trying to change tone and balance and getting nothing special from the HD800. At that point, you should just get another headphone instead.
I agree. Some of the amps that get recommended at Head-Fi to tame the HD800's just made them sound like shittier LCD-X's.
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